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Need advice winding Hamilton Model 21 chronometer (NAVSHIPS pages) "Click" to Login or Register 
IHC Member 1335
Picture of Tom Brunton
posted
Need advice winding Hamilton Model 21 chronometer (NAVSHIPS pages)

My Hamilton model 21 with both boxes arrived today,and seems mechanically fit,and runs for about 10 seconds before stopping. It looks in about mint condition , and is I-D'd to a Victory Ship,the "SS New Rochelle Victory". However though it appears to be fully let down, when I try to wind it it seems to be locked or jammed and will not wind? Anyone have any idea what this signifies???? Confused .

 
Posts: 1746 | Location: Aylmer, Ontario in Canada | Registered: December 15, 2009
posted
Hi Tom,
WAS it shipped without the balance not being blocked ?( That a no no) .Dose the indicator show any power. Are
you winding the right way ? My advice is find a qualified person to look at it. You may want to return it. If you are not careful it could end up a deep money pit.
Hub.
 
Posts: 136 | Location: Warren, Oregon in the USA | Registered: May 28, 2008
IHC Member 1335
Picture of Tom Brunton
posted
hi Hub; yes it was shipped without the balance corked but was extremely well packed and bubble wrapped and double boxed and the balance appears to be fine. However , it's fully wound down and on inserting the key it just won't turn in the winding direction. There is no spring tension against the key ,it's just rock solid and will not wind!!! Frown
 
Posts: 1746 | Location: Aylmer, Ontario in Canada | Registered: December 15, 2009
posted
Hi Tom
Have you had it out of tub? Take it out.
Try winding the main spring a couple turns , Make sure you wind the right way . If you go wrong way
arbor could break . I still think you be ahead to
find qualified persons help . Go to u tube type model 21,get a model 21 manual . Be careful ,
or it could cost some real money to fix. I have
two 21,reg. & break cir.
Hub.
 
Posts: 136 | Location: Warren, Oregon in the USA | Registered: May 28, 2008
IHC Member 1517
posted
Here are a few pages from NAVSHIPS 250-624 that show the winding and setting of the 21

M21 p7
 
Posts: 346 | Location: Woodland Hills, California in the USA | Registered: January 07, 2011
IHC Member 1517
posted
Next page

M21 p8
 
Posts: 346 | Location: Woodland Hills, California in the USA | Registered: January 07, 2011
IHC Member 1517
posted
Running & winding cycles

m21 p13
 
Posts: 346 | Location: Woodland Hills, California in the USA | Registered: January 07, 2011
IHC Member 1335
Picture of Tom Brunton
posted
thanks Hub and Robert.
 
Posts: 1746 | Location: Aylmer, Ontario in Canada | Registered: December 15, 2009
IHC Member 1337
posted
Tom, is the fusee chain on the barrel or on the fusee? There is a wind stop that comes into play when the fusee chain passes over it. You can see this in the previous description. If the chronometer has not been cleaned in a long time then this bar could be stuck in the lock position.
Paul
 
Posts: 278 | Location: Florida in the USA | Registered: December 07, 2009
IHC Member 1335
Picture of Tom Brunton
posted
hi Paul; the chain is on the fusee as shown in photo,and the key works in reverse only,seems locked out in wind mode,??? The movement appears not to be taking power from the fusee,or the fusee is not getting power from the spring drum,Tom

 
Posts: 1746 | Location: Aylmer, Ontario in Canada | Registered: December 15, 2009
IHC Member 1517
posted
Tom, from your photo it doesn't look like the fusee chain is attached to the spring barrel. It should look like it does in figure 12 above. I will post a few more pages from the NAVSHIPS manual on the reassembly of the fusee and barrel when I get a chance to scan them.
 
Posts: 346 | Location: Woodland Hills, California in the USA | Registered: January 07, 2011
IHC Member 1335
Picture of Tom Brunton
posted
excellent eyesight and understanding of the problem,Robert. On closer examination that is exactly the state of affairs with the fusee chain ,it is not attached to the spring drum !!! Eek Confused and I don't know how to re-attach it!!!
 
Posts: 1746 | Location: Aylmer, Ontario in Canada | Registered: December 15, 2009
IHC Member 1335
Picture of Tom Brunton
posted
SO I'M GUESSING THE FUSEE IS WOUND FULLY UP BUT SINCE THE CHAIN WAS NOT ATTACHED ,THE SPRING DRUM IS FULLY UNWOUND ???? Confused
 
Posts: 1746 | Location: Aylmer, Ontario in Canada | Registered: December 15, 2009
IHC Member 1517
posted
Tom, here is a page from NAVSHIPS 250-624 that shows how the chain is attached to the barrel (fig 75)

p53
 
Posts: 346 | Location: Woodland Hills, California in the USA | Registered: January 07, 2011
IHC Member 1517
posted
And here is another that shows the sequence for the initial winding ,steps 53 through 56. I assume that when it says to wind the mainspring in step 56 that it is done by winding the mainspring barrel arbor not the one on the fusee. Hopefully someone who has actually done this will comment if that's not correct!

p56
 
Posts: 346 | Location: Woodland Hills, California in the USA | Registered: January 07, 2011
IHC Member 1517
posted
Here is a little more info from an article that Doug Sinclair did on servicing the Model 21:

"The proper way to set up the mainspring on these chronometers is to wind all of the fusee chain around the fusee
except for about 3 inches and then to position the fusee in the movement. The mainspring barrel is then fitted, and the
other end of the chain is hooked to the barrel. At this point, the mainspring is completely run down. The barrel bridge
and ancillary parts are then assembled, the balance wheel and cock are fitted, and then the mainspring is fully wound,
after which it is let down by the method shown earlier, about a quarter of a turn. During normal operation of the
chronometer, winding actually occurs at the arbor on the fusee, not at the barrel arbor."
 
Posts: 346 | Location: Woodland Hills, California in the USA | Registered: January 07, 2011
IHC Member 1337
posted
On seeing this new photo, I concur with Robert. Of course you will have to find out why it has come detached. Could be a broken mainspring. Look closely as there could be ancillary damage from whiplash.
Paul
 
Posts: 278 | Location: Florida in the USA | Registered: December 07, 2009
IHC Member 32
Picture of Bruce Byrd
posted
After reading this post, I am paranoid. I purchased a very nice Model 21 via an online auction (N869). The photo shows it is wound down completely. Im thinking that those folks would not have a clue on how to lock the balance down or cork it. Is there anything I can do other than double boxing to hope it gets here in one piece. I really don't want to try to walk some auction guy through locking the balance... any ideas?


Bruce Byrd
 
Posts: 887 | Location: San Diego, California USA | Registered: December 27, 2002
IHC Member 1337
posted
Bruce, it should be partially wound and corked. Double bubble wont get rid of trouble!
 
Posts: 278 | Location: Florida in the USA | Registered: December 07, 2009
IHC Member 32
Picture of Bruce Byrd
posted
Any ideas on walking a complete novice thru that complicated process? Hey Paul, You dont live near Melbourne Florida Do you? For that matter, any of our members live around there?


Bruce Byrd
 
Posts: 887 | Location: San Diego, California USA | Registered: December 27, 2002
IHC Member 1337
posted
Bruce, I am about 75 mi from Melborne.
 
Posts: 278 | Location: Florida in the USA | Registered: December 07, 2009
IHC Member 1335
Picture of Tom Brunton
posted
wish you were 75 miles from Aylmer Ontario and
could help with my Hamilton 21 LOL Roll Eyes
 
Posts: 1746 | Location: Aylmer, Ontario in Canada | Registered: December 15, 2009
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