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Swiss Chronograph Questions... "Click" to Login or Register 
IHC President
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Picture of Lindell V. Riddle
posted

Swiss Chronograph Questions...


Recently a friend brought over the interesting Swiss Chronograph you'll see in the images below.

The triple-hinge case has no identification markings of any kind beyond a 25025 serial number, but it is heavy, without question solid-gold and in outstanding condition showing minimal wear. When opening the cuvette movement is presented behind a bezel and glass crystal.

No markings on the dial, but the movement is clearly marked as "E. Leonville, No. 35524" and features a crest with stylized lion holding a staff.

Any information as to when it was made, who made it or additional insights including an idea as to value would be greatly appreciated.


Six images follow...


 
Posts: 10552 | Location: Northeastern Ohio in the USA | Registered: November 19, 2002
IHC President
Life Member
Picture of Lindell V. Riddle
posted


Details of porcelain-enamel dial...


 
Posts: 10552 | Location: Northeastern Ohio in the USA | Registered: November 19, 2002
IHC President
Life Member
Picture of Lindell V. Riddle
posted


Engine turned solid-gold case...


 
Posts: 10552 | Location: Northeastern Ohio in the USA | Registered: November 19, 2002
IHC President
Life Member
Picture of Lindell V. Riddle
posted


Complicated movement under glass...


 
Posts: 10552 | Location: Northeastern Ohio in the USA | Registered: November 19, 2002
IHC President
Life Member
Picture of Lindell V. Riddle
posted


"E. LEONVILLE, No. 35524" markings...


 
Posts: 10552 | Location: Northeastern Ohio in the USA | Registered: November 19, 2002
IHC President
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Picture of Lindell V. Riddle
posted


Serious looking lion on the movement...


 
Posts: 10552 | Location: Northeastern Ohio in the USA | Registered: November 19, 2002
Picture of Jerry Treiman
posted
Lindell - another Leonville movement with the same crest/shield was shown in THIS THREAD. At that time the lion in crest was thought to belong to Badollet or Meylan.
 
Posts: 1455 | Location: Los Angeles, California USA | Registered: January 14, 2003
IHC President
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Picture of Lindell V. Riddle
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Thanks a million Jerry,

That's a great start toward knowing more about this one!

Wink
 
Posts: 10552 | Location: Northeastern Ohio in the USA | Registered: November 19, 2002
posted
According to the book by Meyers, Leonville was registered to Mathey Bros & Mathey, NYC. See the ad on page 168 of Ehrhardt's book number 3. It is for L & A Mathey. They seem to have specialized in complicated watches. Also see page 174 of the same book. It appears Meyers may have misnamed the company. Should it be Mathey Bros. and Mathez? It looks like Meylan may have been the importer of these watches. Somewhat confusing.
 
Posts: 767 | Location: Los Osos, California USA | Registered: December 12, 2002
Picture of Tom McIntyre
posted
This watch was mentioned in the other thread. It is signed Badollet and has the same lion mark.
 
Posts: 633 | Location: Boston, Massachusetts USA | Registered: November 25, 2002
IHC President
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Picture of Lindell V. Riddle
posted

Thanks to both Jerrys and Tom.

So it looks like the "E. Leonville" name in fact belonged to Mathey Bros & Mathey of New York City. After that it gets as Jerry Freedman put it... "somewhat confusing". So what do you think, does that lion in the crest tell us who made the movement, who imported it, who sold it, all of the above, none of the above or what?

I find even higher grade Swiss watches to be very confusing. Confused

Eek
 
Posts: 10552 | Location: Northeastern Ohio in the USA | Registered: November 19, 2002
Picture of Sheila Gilbert
posted
Maybe some questions here would help?
Only a e-mail addy, but also shows the Mark on the page!!!

http://www.badollet.com/


Sheila
 
Posts: 3094 | Location: La Plata, Maryland U.S.A. | Registered: May 22, 2004
IHC Life Member
RR Watch Expert
Picture of Ed Ueberall
posted
Confusing is right!
Kathy Pritchard, in Swiss Timepiece Makers 1775 - 1975 shows the Badollet lion facing to the right, Tom's movement and the Badollet web page shows it facing to the left. Kathy also had the C. H. Meylan lion facing left, possibly the figures' direction got reversed in error, or the right facing lion may have been the trademark of J. M. Badollet & Co. rather than of J. J. Badollet & Co.. The name changed from J. M. to J. J. in 1890. Pritchard reports that J. J. Badollet and Meylan did cooperate together and may have shared the same (left facing) trademark.


Ed Ueberall
IHC Member 34
The Escapement
 
Posts: 620 | Location: Pooler, Georgia in the U.S.A. | Registered: November 23, 2002
IHC President
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Picture of Lindell V. Riddle
posted

Hmmmm,

So, does all that that indicate my friend's watch shown at the beginning of this topic marked with the left-facing Lion with staff shown in the 6th image in this topic was probably manufactured by J. J. Badollet and then imported and sold by Mathey Bros & Mathey of New York City?

Would Mathey have cased the watch or would it have been cased in Switzerland?

(Excuse me, I need some headache medicine... American watches are far less complicated... Big Grin )

Wink
 
Posts: 10552 | Location: Northeastern Ohio in the USA | Registered: November 19, 2002
Picture of Sheila Gilbert
posted
OKOKOKOKOKOK if Ed and Lindell are stumped, you better tell your friend that there is NO HOPE of EVER finding out what it is! LOLOLOL

It's SO GREAT to see the Pro's stumped!!!!!!

YESYESYES

OK I'm alright now.

I've searched so much my brain is dead.


Sheila
 
Posts: 3094 | Location: La Plata, Maryland U.S.A. | Registered: May 22, 2004
IHC Life Member
RR Watch Expert
Picture of Ed Ueberall
posted
My best guess is that the chronograph was made by Meylan or by J.J. Badollet (possibly using Meylan parts), imported by Mathey and cased in the US, either by the importer or by the retailer. Since I think the case may not be original due to the way the lever slot is cut (its not parallel to the lever itself), it is most likely sized to fit a standard American (or Canadian) case.
There, that's my story and I'm stickin' to it! (at least until more evidence is found).


Ed Ueberall
IHC Member 34
The Escapement
 
Posts: 620 | Location: Pooler, Georgia in the U.S.A. | Registered: November 23, 2002
IHC President
Life Member
Picture of Lindell V. Riddle
posted

Thanks Ed, as always you're a great help to all of us!

Anyone who would like to know more about high grade Swiss watches, particularly those used in North American Railroad Time Service should be sure to attend our Chapter 185 Educational Presentation which will be part of the NAWCC Cleveland National Convention June 21-26 in Cleveland, Ohio.

Ed Ueberall's multi-media presentation will include a detailed history and discussion of the various watches approved for North American railroad service that were not U.S. made. Ed's lecture will then be followed by an interview and a wide-ranging question and answer session. Here's more...

Cleveland National, June 21-26 2006 at the Cleveland Convention Center

Lindell

Wink
 
Posts: 10552 | Location: Northeastern Ohio in the USA | Registered: November 19, 2002
IHC Member 660

posted
Returning to the Swiss chrono shown above, the chrono mechanism appears to be of the C. H. Meylan patent. You can compare it to the Waltham-Meylan chronos. There is some connection between Mathey Bros. and Meylan. I thought I had a copy of an ad which carries both names, but cannot find anything.

Mike
 
Posts: 48 | Location: Massachusetts in the USA | Registered: December 24, 2005
IHC President
Life Member
Picture of Lindell V. Riddle
posted

Thanks Mike,

Looks like we now have the whole story.

The collective knowledge you guys have to share really amazes many of us!

We look forward to seeing you in October at the 2006 Ward Francillon Time Symposium which will also be held in Northern Ohio. That too should be a great event!

Lindell

Wink
 
Posts: 10552 | Location: Northeastern Ohio in the USA | Registered: November 19, 2002
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