The 20 jewel version of the grade 149(HC) or grade 150(OF)don't show up that often since 500 or less were made before Elgin added another jewel to get the total up to 21. I currently have a version of both but another popped up on ebay lately that was mislabeled and not much bidding on it so I picked up another one. Elgin did change the dmk effect early in the run of 500 because the 149 that I just purchased (in the 400 (of 500) range) has a different dmk effect from the other (under 70 (of 500) unit range). I will post both version when the 2nd one arrives but wondered if anyone else has the 20j versions that they can post to see if there are any other dmk variants for the 20j run.

Way to go Claude. I wouldn't know one if it jumped up and bit me but I am looking forward to seeing yours.

Claude what jewel does the 21 jewel Elgin have that the 20 jewel doesn't...

I will pull the dial and take a picture, but off the top of my head I would guess a cap jewel.

Harry they all are from the first run, 149 or 150, with the ending sequence less than 500 but the biggest tip off is that it is missing any jewel engraving on the barrel bridge, where if it was a 17j it would still have the jewel markings and 21j are marked but not the 20j.


My 20j 150 that I picked up was advertised as a 17j even though it was not marked and I picked it up at a nice price. This 149 cost me less than 200 but was not cased (movement, dial, hands only). They are not marked as "star" watches in the price guide but clearly for any watch that is made in a number 500 or less should rate a star or two. I will post all 3, the 2 149's and the 150 that I have along with a normal 149 and 150 (21j).

150 dial


150 movement (note missing jewel marking)

Interesting item Claude,

Here is the best available information for your 6349077 movement number:

http://elginwatches.org/cgi-bi...349077&action=search

This line stands out:

150 Grade: 7,816 made 20-21-Jewel, A-A5P - Marked: None, Father Time or 150

Apparently yours is the "Marked None" variant that could be 20 or 21-Jewel movement.

Now, please do let us know the MOVEMENT NUMBER for the Hunter you mentioned above.

Don

That is a gorgeous watch Claude. As you know Claude I don't collect Elgin's unless I just see one that strikes my fancy and I did pick up a 17 jewel the other day that looks almost new serial number 8324212. Since you collect Elgin's you probably know all there is to know by just the serial number.

The 180 was about as good a railroad watch as Elgin produced, the hunter version grade 183 were later upjeweled to the grade 348. They should be marked BWR, 17 jewels with gold settings and a double sunk dial. These were just below the 149/150 in terms of quality and pricing.

Claude I know you have seen mine before, but here they are, for all to peruse.
Not good picture quality, but photography isn't one of my attributes.
1st. 20 j 150 dial
2nd 20 j 150 mvmt
3rd 21 j 149 dial
4th 21 j 149 mvmt.

Bill

2 This one is the 29th 150 made

3

4

Well thank you Claude I knew it stuck my fancy for some reason.

Harry, good pick especially if it looks like new since these were RR approved many of the ones that you find look like they lived a hard working life.

On Donald's post, on the grade 150 they are nearly all unmarked and except for the very 1st run (about 500 units) they were all 21 jewel. You will at times see the grade 150, especially if it went to Canada marked "150". I gather this was done to satisfy Canadian RR regulations in the early 1900's. I can't recall seeing a 150 marked as "Father Time" but many of the grade 149 are, the 149 can be found unmarked, marked as "Father Time" or in rare cases marked as "348".

In the case of the OF 150 that I and Bill posted if it is does not have 21 "Jewels" engraved on the barrel plate the odds are extremely high it is a 20j variant unless someone later had the 21st jewel added.

Bill's 150 is probably the lowest serial number that I have seen, mine is in the first 100 but not as low as Bill's.

The 149 is lever set the 150 is pendant set, you can find lever set grades from the 150 serial number runs that should be classified as grade 277.

Claude here are a couple of pictures of the Elgin I lucked into for less than $80. The pictures are not great just taken from my phone but you get the idea.

Front

The dial is nice and is correct for this serial number. It would have been adjusted to at least 3 positions, in the later runs the Elgin full plates were bumped up to 5 positions. You will see some of the higher grade full plates marked "5 Positions" where the "5 Positions" looks like an after thought.

Movement finally arrived (took about a week to get from Tampa to Atlanta)and it is even nicer in person. A hairline and chip free dial, dust band still intact, no rust but one screwdriver slip on the barrel bridge that is near invisible except in certain viewing angles. It is late in the 6,348,xxx run but the dmk effect on the plates or balance cock is no where close to the dmk shown on my 20j 150 posted. Will post pictures of it tonight along with my other 149 20j.