[Here's an old thread revisited, pictures added, just a year & 1/2 later !!] ;


If one had a Sangamo Getty;

Serial no. 1,602,553

21RJ- ON5L- T6PI

Circa 1902

What damaskeened pattern would the movement have??

Also should it be marked "Adjusted, Temperature, 6 Positions, Isochronism"

OR

Simply "Adjusted" ??

regards,
bb

Buster,
If I am reading it right and I might not be I believe it should have:
Temperature, 6 positions, Iso
Bright spotted 3rd pattern.
I never really have been able to read this book right, but thats my take.
Pg 119 of the encyclopedia.
Bill

Thanks Bill,

That is how that I interpret the Meggers & Ehrhardt Illinois Vol. 2 Blue Book also.

However, this watch is damaskeened in the Gold-Inlayed-Ribbon 2nd Pattern and is only marked "Adjusted" and also is a P.L. watch

So I am perplexed

Until I can post some pictures, I certainly would appreciate some more comments on any and all perspectives that anyone wishes to post & reply

regards,
bb

Here is a picture of another one..... this one is 1530623 (I believe) Which was in the 3rd to the last run of this model. Apparently some were for the Paillard Watch Co. and some were for Mongomery Wards.

Steve

Buster;

Actually, they overlapped so in that serial # range they could have either. Obviously, yours is the earlier grade, I actually like these "wavy ribbon" ones the best. Some years back we had a rather lively discussion as to how many wavys were pink and how many gold?

The information I have is that the last one made was serial number 1602600 and it was in a run of 600 as were the previous 2 runs. Another note said that the ones made for the Paillard Watch Co. were the Bright Spotted 3d pattern.

Steve

Obviously, information is king Being said, all that I have to reference is The Price Guide [ no help ], and the Illinois Vol. 2 Blue Book.

Pg 119 of The Blue Book shows two columns, a left column and a right column...

Now stay with me and follow me please......

In the left column watch serial no 1,602,553 will not fit into any of the 9 different Sangamo's serial no. ranges. Period......

But in the right column watch serial no 1,602,553 does fit in with the 2nd batch of 4 different Sangamo's serial no. ranges and would be correct with it being 21RJ-ON5L-T6PI.

IF the watch serial no 1,602,553 DID fit into the left side column serial no. ranges AT ALL, then I could understand this better as to "overlapping" etc.. But as you see it does not.

So, I do not have blinders on and I am open, yet all that I can understand is that the watch 1,602,553 has been designated by The Blue Book as to be in the right column of pg. 119 ONLY. And so being, it should be marked Adjusted, Temperature, 6 Positions, Isochronism and all are listed as being the Bright Spotted [third] Pattern. This information I have taken from my spiral bound copy of The Illinois Blue Book Vol. 2 .

If you have followed me till now, the "overlapping" numbers I DO understand, but it doesn't apply to 1,602,553. Steve's example 1,530,623 [pictured] DOES fit into the LEFT column and matches correctly to The Blue Book exactly under the 4th listing of the 9 different watch listings !!

So now what , as I am only more confused and ready for the "rubber room". Help

I sincerely hope you are seeing my point Can any of you set me straight and make me see? I DO want to see your points and explanations OR other related material, please. I remain open...

regards,
bb

Buster,
That is why sometimes I hesitate to answer as I only try what I read in whatever the authority is, in this case the Blue book. Unfortunately even at that sometimes I miss what is actually being said. I also checked as you did and found the numbers failed to fit, except for the right column.
I understand that the Blue book had been rewritten by the authors from company records, so I guess it would mean likely there would be some room for error
Good luck with your quest.
Bill

My Illinois Disc file shows s/n 1602553 is part of the last 600 piece (10Th) run of a total 3200 Sangamo 21J OF movements marked "AJJUSTED" with no marking of the number of adjustments and from 1897 to 1902 they were Damaskeened three different ways.

This last run is correctly reported to be "Gold inlaid Ribbon (second) Pattern damaskeened nickel" plates.

By this record, Buster's watch, s/n 1602001 - 1602600 is exclusive to the left column of page 119 in the Blue book, but is not included at all in either column of page 119 in that book. An oversight that is picked up by the disk file record.

Thanks David !

Your last paragraph says it all !

I am using the actual book and perhaps most people are using the disc. That may explain our somewhat different quotes and opinions. Thankfully I remained open until the problem was pointed out by David.

Thanks to all the postings & replies in this mystery now solved..

regards,
bb

Sangamo Getty's 2nd Pattern "GoldInlayedRibbon" with PL's are not seen often

So this one is being "revisited" today as I didn't have pictures of the watch back then and I plum forgot about it !!

regards,
bb