This is a very nice Waltham 12s, model 1894, Smith Patterson Co I purchased a while ago.
Has anyone else been lucky enough to find one with their enitials engraved on it?

Just 30 years older than me.

no, but I found this



happy hunting,

Bill kapp

aka William G Kapp

All right Bill, now that is definately a lucky find!

Nice Ed

Not sure if this is your jeweler, is the movement marked also?

This is from the 1895 city directory for Montreal Quebec Canada.

Tom

Bill

Nice Illinois dial (at least that's my guess.

There was a William Kapp in Toledo in the 1880 census listed as a watchmaker, he was born about 1861 in Ohio

Tom

Tom,
I'm not sure either. Some how I got the impression the company was from New York City. But I don't know why.

Perhaps there were more than one or it was a chain, I also found one In Boston Ma. about the same time.

Tom

I think they might have been the same company, I found this in Who's who in New England, Volume 2 1915

Tom,
I am probably wrong about the city, it is most likely Boston.
Thanks for the information.

Ed

Your welcome Ed, I did find a little more that showed the two companies as being the same business, one in Boston & one in Montreal.

Tom

Thanks tom,

I have no idea if it is Illinois. Its 16sz, four feet.approx 10,24.5,36.5,55.5.

don't own or study the 16sz watches but picked up the dial for obvious reasons.

happy hunting,

Hi Bill

I would guess it is an Illinois, there 4 foot dial is kind of a strange duck, from what I understand Illinois didn't make a watch that took a 4 post dial but for some reason they made the dial, most of the time the post at 10 is cut off. You see these on a lot of private label Illinois watches.

Tom

Tom,

You are right! The post at 10 is cut off! I thought it was a defect. Amazing that you would know that.

happy hunting,

Your welcome Bill, I had one like that & I remember reading it some where, looking in the gold book the dial would have fit a model 4 or 5 Getty.

Tom

Tom,

Have no idea what a Getty is, but the pic in the price guide makes this look like a model 5.

Ok, I used the search button and found Tom's
"A Getty model has only the ratchet wheel visible & there is a crescent shaped click. These models the 4 & 5 were named after their designer Fred I Getty"

From the serial number it seems to be a 21J Sangamo about 1902.

Do you know if J G Kapp succeeded W G kapp in Toledo about 1902?

Thanks,

and happy hunting

Hi Bill

Where did you find that, is it yours?

I had seen J.G. Kapp when I was looking for William, I was wondering if they were perhaps brothers JG was older than William & looking at the city directories for Toledo he had quite a few people working for him including William perhaps.

He was John George Kapp born about 1854 in Ohio. Below is the page from the 1880 city directory & on it you can see where there is a William that works for JG & it looks like William lives at the store if I read it right.

I think I might have found them both as brothers in the 1860 census in Millcreek, Hamilton, Ohio. There parents were from Germany & both boys were born in Ohio, John was around 2 years or so older than William. There father was a butcher.

In the 1900 Toldeo census it shows John born in March 1854 & William was born Jan 1860, for each of them it says they were born in Ohio & their parents were from Germany. I think it is more than likely the same guys from the 1860 census & they are brothers.

That is probably clear as mud now huh Bill?

Tom

By the way the JP Kapp movement you show is a model 5 Sangamo grade, I show made in 1898

I purchased two wrist watches with my name on the dials and movements. Here is the link to the page I posted here in April 2008.



ELOGA

Ernie,

Congrats! It is after all a hobby and what great fun to be able to pursue it in such a personalized way.

Tom,

no, it is not mine, another collector contacted me to let me know of its existence. not sure where if anywhere the contact will lead as the owner hasn't followed up the initial contact yet. maybe I will hear more after the hollidays.

I think I pulled the 1902 date from one of the 185 databases in the Illinois Research Forum threads. Erhardts Illinois book agrees with the 1898 date.

Thanks for all the family info! You make it too easy for all of us! I can't believe how quickly you come up with this stuff.

happy hunting,

Hi all,

The coincidence of seeing a movement so closely resembling my dial caused me to reexamine my dial under high magnification. My dial has been altered from J kapp to W Kapp! I will keep it as a sentimental but worthless curio but cease searching for a matching movement.



Thanks to all those who searched their records and possessions in an effort to assist me.


happy hunting,

Bill

Sorry to hear about that but it makes sense now, I was just going to post that I found that John George Kapp's brother was William F. Kapp & I couldn't fin another Kapp with the initials W.G. in Toledo.

I guess someone else wanted a W Kapp dial too.

Tom