I recently came across my Great-grandfather’s Elgin pocket watch. It’s in pieces, with many missing. I’m just starting out here, and thinking of buying a similar watch here, or on eBay to try and resurrect it. Don’t want to be naïve; I just need help in the right direction. This is my first post. Thanks
G.M. Wheeler
Grade: 44
Movement Serial Number: 4745154
Estimated Production Year: 1893
Run Quantity: 1000
Size: 18s
Jewels: 15j
Movement Configuration: Open-faced
Movement Finish: Nickel
Model: 5
Class: 9

These were quite common so I think some of the guys that service watches on this site should have the parts needed to complete it, you have the parts that would have serial numbers on them. Take the yellow dial and toss it in the trash there is not hope for it and putting it back on will only rust your hands.

If you need a name send me a private message and I will make some suggestions.

As an 1890's vin. movement, this probably pre-dates your Grandpa. With many parts missing or questionable, I would normally suggest finding a similar COMPLETE vintage movement and restoring that using the dial from this one to make a watch that represents that period. Re-assembling this one with the parts left is totally possible but only worthwhile for sentimental reasons. Even the crown winding stem is missing which is often one of the harder parts to replace

Robert, You are starting out the same way I did. Trying to save my Grandfather's old Keystone Lancaster. From an intrinsic value it wasn't worth saving, but I wanted it because it was his.
Dave Abbe saved it for me and that was the beginning of my interest in old watches and how to repair them. I've now been at it for about three years, have learned a lot, and have a looong way to go. But it's been a joy to belong to this forum and learn from all the seasoned members.
I encourage you to spend $15 to join this group, and have full access to the wealth of knowledge and friendship of the members.

Robert if you going to use the original case
I might help you with the stem and crown also have
lots of glass .
Do not use the yellow one.
contact me or send me the bezel and missing crown case I will attempt to fix it for you no charge.
no promises as Dave A. mention on crown and stem
its not easy task but can be done as I did for few members.
And have fun.

Robert,

It looks like you have the main parts to the watch that are numbered. Your plan of finding another movement for parts is what’s going to be required. Members can post a listing in the wanted section here and see if anything is available. Keep an eye on ebay and something will show up. Watch shows are another choice and usually the prices there will be good for a parts movement.

One issue you’re going to have is on an older watch like yours the parts aren’t so easily interchangeable. It looks like there are jewels missing and that may cause you to use the wheel or arbor from the parts watch rather than using the ones you have.

In my opinion the watch is a family heirloom and should be brought back to being operational. A project like this may take months or more for someone to complete so patience is necessary. It may cost some dollars but in the end you’ll get a great feeling seeing, hearing, and carrying your Great Grandfathers’ watch.

RR

I’ll toss the bezel in the trash. I can’t understand how a watch from the 1890’s could have a ‘plastic’ bezel. I thought that polycarbonates only came into existence in the mid 1900’s…? Looks like the crown and stem replacement might be little over my head at this point. I am grateful for the responses posted... It amazes me just how considerate and sincere everyone is. I’m really hooked. I would have already signed up for membership, but my PayPal account needs my attention before I can use it. So, in the meantime, I have limited abilities. Thanks!

Don't you mean 'plastic crystal' rather than bezel? Throw that yellow crystal away, not the bezel!
The bezel is the shouldered metal ring that the crystal sits in and either snaps or screws back on the front of the case to cover the dial.
Regards! Mark

Robert, the 1940's plastic "war plastic" crystal was a replacement after the original glass either got broken or too scratched up to easily read time.

These early plastics would out-gas some type of chemical as it broke down due to age and exposure to ultra-violet or infra-red radiation and this would rust hands, pinions etc. As Dave mentioned over the years the original crystal (glass in the early years) would get broken or scratched, chipped beyond use and would get replaced with these plastic crystals that would age and cause problems.

In 1893 Elgin would not have produced the grades 149/150 (20/21j) yet so besides the 15j movements only the 17j grades would have been higher jeweled. I don't think the grade 44 was adjusted but that might not always be the case.

In its day this was a good watch and the fact that it has a history with your family makes the value even higher.

Mark C, sorry about the terminology mix up....I did mean to say the crystal. I have a long way to go, but been reading some phenomenal posts...the Dudley masonic restoration by Kuhn is simply breathtaking.

LOL! NO problem, my friend. I do it all the time myself. I just wanted to make sure that WAS the case, as if you DID toss the bezel, it would be a pain to try and find another that would fit your case.

HIGH regards! Mark

Honestly Mark, if it wasn't for the mere fact that it belonged to my great-grandfather, it's pretty much a junk. Logic would dictate for it's intrinsic value, it be tossed in the trash...Unfortunately, I'm sentimental, I will stop at nothing to bring it back to life and enjoy every moment doing so. I only wish I could travel back in time to find out which person in my family was the 'technician' who decided to take the watch apart in the first place...that fella deserves the 'from the neck down' trophy

Robert, the watch is completely salvageable. None of us are disputing that, I for one (of many of us) is simply looking at HOW to find the best way to do the job. The wind-set parts may still be there under the dial. That would be a big help.
The movement is an in-line escapement, and that helps a ton as it appears we need to find a new pallet fork assembly.
If the serial numbers all match for the balance cock, balance wheel and plates, we are miles ahead in getting started.

My comment (ironically) that finding a crown stem that works could be the hardest part was a tongue in cheek comment that (hopefully) the movement will restore fairly easily.

It is only your decision when to start.

David, I just want to say you are an excellent host and moderator. You are most gracious and kind, and I thank you. I've decided to send Peter Kaszubski the watch case. His expertise will help me out with the crown/stem, size up a new glass crystal, and maybe buff up the watch case a little. He's a good guy for stepping forward.
The case is, or should I say, was Silverode, badly worn and scratched. The question here is, do I leave the case as is, or should I have it replated. I know many times with antiques, refinishing is a no no, but I'm not sure what the rule is for pocket watches. What should I do?

What do you think?

Second photo

...

Robert, no need to plate "Silverode" an alloy containing 1% magnesium, 54% copper and 45% nickel which just plain polishes out "real shiny". I usually lightly buff these out with buffing compound and then polish on a second wheel loaded with rouge.

David, that's great news. Will be shipping the case to Peter tomorrow. A long ride from Massachusetts to Arizona

Hi everyone, just thought I'd update my posting.
I just won an eBay auction on an exact duplicate for my Great-grandfather's pocket watch. Since it is missing so many parts,it just made sense to find a complete movement, in order to restore it. I think $28 is reasonable enough for a nice movement. Actually, it's almost too nice to use as a salvage piece. Still might get something else to fix my Great-grandfather's Wheeler. Please hear me out...
I've been spending a lot of time reading all kinds of posts and digging deep, literally reading anything that has to do with watchmaking. Even looking at YouTube videos and purchasing several books , just trying to learn and acquire knowledge about horology.Let's face it, it's intriguing. Okay, since I have two eyes and one mouth, I'll try to read twice as much as I run my mouth! The following are some observations I've made so far, (if any newbie like me is interested). First, my interest in this forum and horology, is as a hobby. What that means, is this is something I really enjoy and love, and not a new career. There are MANY in IHC185 who have an encyclopedic knowledge of watches and clocks, and they help with zeal and it is amazing. There is also a wealth of information on this forum. What I mean by this is, anyone using the search engine, will be amazed what is out there. Here's the way I look at it, if I might be so bold, let's not be lazy and expect to be spoon fed all the info.
Something else I decided to do is, to purchase the Chicago School of Watchmaking CD for $15 from eBay...I'm not sure what everyone's opinion is on this one, but the reviews are outstanding. No, I'm not getting paid for this endorsement, nor do I have any interest in it. It's just well worth the money in MY OPINION. The people selling the CD are okay too!There are other courses too. Another epiphany I've had was to work on a 'sacrificial' pocket watch as my first 'restoration' rather than making a mess of my heirloom piece. I actually feel confident I could work on the real thing and be successful. It's just the prudent thing to do. Any opinions? I'll add to this post as I make progress and also post photos.

Welcome, Robert.

Like you, I stumbled across this bunch years ago while trying to piece together my father's watch. Whatever the market value of your watch, I'm glad you're restoring it simply because it's an heirloom.

My dad's Hamilton 993, the very watch that started me on this hobby:

And also like you, I wondered if I should leave my dad's watch in the clunker case that it was in, or find an appropriate improvement. I chose to upgrade to something a little better:

Agree and disagree
agree on gold filled case if is all worn out
but on silveroid case buffing and you good to go
here is Roberts case after I fixed it for him.
Bow is tight new acrylic glass and new crown
and few minutes on buffing wheel tada!

Front
Received yesterday on it way home to MA. today.

Peter, thank you so much for helping me with my watch. I literally had a smile from ear to ear, when I saw the photos. Incidentally, I mailed the case to Arizona on Saturday, USPS Priority, you received it Tuesday (yesterday). It is on it's way back to Massachusetts today (Wednesday). I'm not sure when you worked on it, but that's a quick turnaround, besides covering a lot of country. Peter, you've made a new friend. Thanks again

Eric, thank you for your kind words of encouragement. Your Dad's Hamilton is absolute eye candy. I have to agree with your idea of upgrading the case. It really does do it justice. A family treasure for generations to come. I appreciate your input. Thanks

Hopefully Robert the rest of your project will be
as fast and soon you will have the watch ticking
if not some people here will help you make him toc
Im sure of that.