Because this was mentioned in another topic recently, I thought I would post this to show what I was talking about.


https://ihc185.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/10860...241016932#7241016932


I often use the rule of thumb that Peter does, but............

As you know, I watch for my Pansy (So far, all Elgins) all the time, and in doing so, you get to know small 0s and 3/0s etc, watches. I had noticed that most 0s in a Solid Gold case are going through the roof in price, and a small 7j Elgin, will sell for over $500.00 just because it has a Fancy Dial and it's gold. I realize that the price of gold is way up, but with newbies in there bidding with no idea of the value of a watch, they are fighting over these watches.

Two years ago, you could often pick this up for less than $200.00, today they are really high, it they are Fancy enough and the case is gold.

This watch doesn't even have a fancy dial!!!!

Pretty clean though.

Movement

Hi Shiela,
I agree with you but, I gotta say, the example you posted has a pretty interesting case. The first thing I noticed was the unusual zig-zag ornamental engine turning. The second thing I think I see (double check me here)is that the engraving work looks to be about half finished.
I've been trying to learn the order in which the engine turning and hand engraving were accomplished. This example gives me a lot of clues.
-Cort
p.s. -Did you notice there are two very different engine turned patterns? Mighty unusual case! 500- bucks, hmm, sorry.

I have to say that I did notice the outstanding and complicated design of the case of this watch, and if I were in the market for a case, this would be a top runner.

I have paid $500.00 or more for one of my Pansy's in a solid gold case, but unless I was looking for an exceptional watch case, I would not pay that much for a standard watch in a nice case.

HOWEVER, I guess the point is showing itself right here, if someone wants a FINE EXAMPLE of a Gorgeous case, they will pay a lot for it, and that has an impact on collecting watches in general.

Today, if I want a spacific watch movement, and it's in a gold case, I believe that the cost is going to be over double what it was just a year ago, or I would have to find one one in a GF case.

I think today, it's kind of like JEWELERY again, as it has been mentioned before, and that changes the way I have to consider a buy.

All in all, I guess we have to take the JEWELRY part into consideration, when we find a watch that we have been searching for, for a long time.

As far as the case goes, take a look at the detail on this part of the watch, WHAT A BEAUTY!

Talk about skill!

that's Art!

Cort-I don't think that the zig-zag pattern was engine turned. It looks to me to be hand done, although it's hard to tell from just the photos.

I got hooked on them about 5 years ago, and since then, I have found information about Mr. Lissauer who sold them.

So far, all of the TRADEMARK Pansy's I have are Elgins, in a size 0s and have been in the 6,xxx,xxx - 7,xxx,xxx range, 7 Jewels, with a Pansy Flower on a Fancy Dial, and most have the Pansy trademark on the Movement also.

Mr. Lissauer sold watches on Maiden Lane in New York. He was a jewelar there in the very early days, so most of his items are from before 1906 when he passed away.

I own 7 of the 9 that I have seen, However I'm sure that there are still more out there.

The pictures I have right now are not very good, but I will post more when I get my other computer up and running.

Here are a few BAD photos.

All of my Pansy's are supposed to be in Hunter cases, however one of these is in an open face case.

Below is the Pansy Hallmark (Not Mine)

This is a Really Bad case, However, the Movement is actually pretty clean.

See the Pansy on the MOVEMENT

I have finally started a paper about the Company, Mr. Lissauer, and his Private label watch, and I will post it when I finish it.