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Welcome Aboard IHC185™ Internet Horology Club 185 IHC185™ Discussion Site Main Page Open to the World RESEARCH FORUMS Illinois Watch Company Research Forum Bunn Special 163, 163-E and 163-A "THE SEVEN STARS" Database
Internet Horology Club 185 IHC185™ Discussion Site Main Page Open to the World RESEARCH FORUMS Illinois Watch Company Research Forum Bunn Special 163, 163-E and 163-A "THE SEVEN STARS" DatabaseGo | New Topic | Find-Or-Search | Notify | Tools | Reply to Post | |
• Bunn Special 163, 163-E and 163-A "THE SEVEN STARS" Database Our goal here is to openly share information about how many of each variant are found in the various production runs, and with this compilation of data further refine the estimates of production for each of the 7 variants in this series. The following 7 posts in this topic will identify each of the different variants and contain the data on observed movement numbers for each variant. As additional movement numbers are confirmed we will periodically update the information contained in those 7 posts. Along with the details and data on each variant, I will post a movement photo from my collection. Any accurately confirmed additions would be great, you may send them to our ihc185@roadrunner.com eMail address. • CORRECT DIALS: "FIVE GENUINE ILLINOIS 161 AND 163 VARIANT DIALS INCLUDING "23J" DIALS IN DETAIL" Lindell  | |||
163 Type I R ("850" produced) "Sixty Hour" above "Bunn Special" markings on train bridge. Marked "Motor Barrel" and "23 Jewels" on the barrel bridge with grade number "163" to the LEFT, rather than the center area, not an Elinvar movement. Confirmed movement numbers... 5321151 5321261 5321265 5321275 5321280 5321299 5321305 5321309 5321367 5321420 (EP/LVR) 5321440 5321450 5321469 5321475 5321488 (Shown below, Lindell V. Rddle collection) 5321497 5321499 5321585 (LVR) 5321602 5321625 5321630 5321644 5321661 5321664 5321712 5321716 5321742 5321755 5321775 5321782 5321800 5321815 5321828 5321839 5321903 5321930 5321954 5321978 (Tom Dunn) 5321994  | ||||
163 Type II ("50" produced) Marked "Motor Barrel" and "Sixty Hour" on the barrel bridge with grade number 163 to the right, this is not an Elinvar movement. Notice "23-Jewels" at an angle on right edge of the train bridge. Confirmed movement numbers and sales... 5421625 (Sold in July 2014) 5421640 (Shown below, Lindell V. Riddle collection) 5421672 (Sold for $18,256.00 on eBay September 2010) 5421710 (Confirmed Private Sale for $28,000.00 in November 2006)  5421771 (CW) 5421802 (February 2022) 5421943 (J&H Auction for $27,000.00 with cracked dial and worn case November 2006)  5421981 (October 2021) 5448032 (Shown in Illinois Book page 127) 5448054 (Sold for $16,386.00 on eBay in October 2010) 5448142 (November 2018) 5448151 (October 2012) 5448161 (Resold February 2008) 5448165 (September 2011 to Lindell V. Riddle collection) 5448179 (SM) 5448222 5448261 (Seller stopped eBay auction for a low-ball $7,500.00 offer in May 2009) 5448264 (Sold for $15,600.64 in November of 2008 then resold for $22,322.22 in December 2009)  | ||||
163 Type I E ("900" produced) Marked "Motor Barrel" and "23 Jewels" on the barrel bridge with grade number "163" to the right, marked "Elinvar" at edge of balance bridge and "Sixty Hour" on train bridge above the Bunn Special marking. Confirmed movement numbers... 5420034 5420175 5420235 5420264 5420379 5420388 (Shown below, Lindell V. Riddle collection) 5420396 5420403 5420578 5420713 5420714 5420722 5420743 5420778 5420804 5421055 5421220 (EP/LVR) 5421289 5421333 5421340 5421063 5421223 5421259 (Double-Boxed Set with Card in YGF 118 Case) 5421365 5421404 5421564  | ||||
163 Type II E ("300" produced) Marked "Motor Barrel" and "Sixty Hour" on the barrel bridge with grade number 163 to the right, marked "Elinvar" on edge of balance bridge. Notice "23-Jewels" on right edge of train bridge. Confirmed movement numbers... 5421606 (Shown below, Lindell V. Riddle collection) 5421617 5421628 5421664 5421705 5421712 5421723 5421760 5421768 (EP/LVR) 5421793 5421808 (Boxed Set with Case 118) 5421830 5421837 5421839 5421872 5421884 5421888 5421897 5421932 5421969 5421975 5421977 5421979 5421984 5448018 5448028 5448043 5448045 5448087 5448094 5448103 5448184 5448185 5448186 5448203 5448205 5448210 5448239 5448247 5448252 (Boxed example) 5448569  | ||||
163A Type II B ("1,800" produced) Marked "Motor Barrel" and "Sixty Hour" on the barrel bridge with grade number 163A to the right, marked "Elinvar" on the upper edge of train bridge above the "Bunn Special" marking and "23 Jewels" on right edge of train bridge. Confirmed movement numbers... 5448331 5448377 5448397 5448408 5448419 5448424 5448437 5448461 5448463 5448473 5448496 5448513 5448531 (EP/LVR) 5448569 5448572 5448619 5448639 5448660 5448678 5448727 (Complete Double-Boxed Set with Card in YGF 107 Case / LVR Collection) 5448732 5448764 5448776 5448782 5448803 5448817 5448833 5448835 5448872 5448873 5448905 5448927 5448944 5448946 5448957 5448991 5456005 5456080 5456110 5456125 5456135 5456137 (Boxed Set) 5456154 5456180 5456187 5456194 5456215 5456233 5456235 (Boxed Set) 5456282 5456293 5456300 5456319 5456332 5456365 5456405 5456406 5456427 (Boxes only, originally YGF Model 107 Case) 5456447 5456460 5456484 (Shown below, Lindell V. Riddle collection) 5456544 5456569 5456594 5456596 5456599 (CAUTION! Click these words to read previous "Pitfalls" discussion!) 5456643 5456648 (CAUTION! This watch has incorrect components! -- including INCORRECT NON-ELINVAR BALANCE assembly). 5456651 5456734 5456736 5456747 5456731 (Star YGF 118 Case, inner box, card, no outer box) 5456779 5456845 5456848 5456881 5456904 5456943 5456945 5456959 5456969 5457027 5457036 5457093 5457174 5457200  | ||||
163A Type II P ("1,300" produced) Marked "Motor Barrel" and "Sixty Hour" on the barrel bridge with grade number 163A to the right, marked "Elinvar" on pillar plate which is below the balance wheel. Confirmed movement numbers... 5457228 5457245 5457251 5457274 5457276 5457363 5457366 5457384 5457387 5457438 5457521 5457529 5457532 5457567 5457573 5457605 5457606 5457659 5457700 5457768 5457798 5457799 5457806 5457809 5457827 5457836 5457840 5457852 5457861 5457873 5457903 5457928 5457938 5457956 5457970 5457984 5457995 5563018 5563020 5563035 5563037 5563042 5563064 (EP/LVR) 5563079 5563169 5563257 5563261 5563264 5563265 5563266 5563281 5563284 5563303 5563321 5563348 (Shown below, Lindell V. Riddle collection) 5563374 5563398  | ||||
| IHC President Life Member  |
I began dropping in images of examples from my collection. And now we watch the numbers grow.  | |||
Great Thread!... I plan on contributing the numbers of every example I have recorded on these variants........... Happy "Numbers" Hunting! | ||||
I have: 163 Type IR 5321440 163A Type IIP 5457245 | ||||
Mine are both are 163 type I 5,375,178 5,375,326 | ||||
Mine is a 163 IE 5421340 | ||||
| IHC President Life Member |
This is all good.  | |||
I have Series 1 Ser No 5375468 J Smith | ||||
IHC Life Member |
Heres three you can add to the list: Type I # 5421352 Type IIB # 5456845 Type IIB # 5448678 Regards Fred | |||
| IHC President Life Member |
Today I finally put in the last images, so we now have an example of each of the "Seven Stars" for comparison. Keep those numbers coming. | |||
Ok, ok, just don't tell the wife. 163 type 1 5420093 163 type IIB 5456080 Charlie | ||||
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Here's mine, 163A Type IIB 5448419 (looks to be the earliest IIB movement number so far) Nathan | |||
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I have 5,375,688, a type 1 with "23-J" variant dial. Ron | |||
IHC Life Member |
I have a Type ll P Serial #5457276 with a 23 J Variant Dial. In a WGF #206 Case. Weldon | |||
| IHC Life Member Site Moderator  |
I have a Type I with serial # 5334072. The watch is in a Model 173 case with dial marked "Illinois Bunn Special" and "23 Jewel 60 Hour" above the seconds area. John III | |||
| IHC President Life Member |
This is coming together nicely.  Keep sharing those numbers, we are very grateful for your help! | |||
| IHC Life Member Site Moderator |
Three more, 163 Type I: 5334351 and 5334427 163A Type IIP: 5457809 163A Type IIB: 5456110 These are from a friend who shared their Illinois collection with me. John III | |||
Lindell, 163 Type I: 5334564 23Jewel60 Hour dial model 206 two tone Bob | ||||
| IHC President Life Member |
Thanks Bob, Sounds like a beautiful watch! Lindell | |||
And I have 5563169 J dial pointed bow Star case. Dave | ||||
| IHC President Life Member |
Thanks Dave, sounds like a late Type II P in a 118 case which is a great combination. We'll add 5563169 to the database! Lindell | |||
I see your info on Bunn Special's and checked one I have to see which series mine fell into. It looks like mine is a 163 type II E, by the serial numbers. Mine is serial number 5448205 in a Bunn Special 181 case, Dial is marked Illinois Bunn Special and 23 jewel 60 hour above the seconds dial. Also double sunk and in mint condition as is the movement and case. Just thought I would pass this on to add to your list. Thanks, | ||||
| IHC President Life Member |
Thanks Wayne, your movement and dial are a prize  and the 181 case can be a difficult one to find. Yours is now on the list. Interestingly we have 5448203 previously recorded which makes me wonder if the one in between is out there... somewhere!Lindell | |||
Lindell, 163 Type I: 5421236 with a 23Jewel, 60 Hour Bunn Special Dial Model 173 white gold filled case J. C. Petty | ||||
| IHC President Life Member |
Thanks John, yours is added to the listing. Your Case 173 in White Gold-Filled is one of my favorites. Lindell | |||
| IHC Vice President Pitfalls Moderator IHC Life Member  |
I put the production estimates for the seven variants into Excel and made a pie chart that illustrates their relative scarcity.  | |||
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Welcome Aboard IHC185™ Internet Horology Club 185 IHC185™ Discussion Site Main Page Open to the World RESEARCH FORUMS Illinois Watch Company Research Forum Bunn Special 163, 163-E and 163-A "THE SEVEN STARS" Database
Internet Horology Club 185 IHC185™ Discussion Site Main Page Open to the World RESEARCH FORUMS Illinois Watch Company Research Forum Bunn Special 163, 163-E and 163-A "THE SEVEN STARS" Database©2002-2023 Internet Horology Club 185™ - Lindell V. Riddle President - All Rights Reserved Worldwide
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