Gary again...

As I mentioned before I am migrating from coin collecting (both US and ancient) to collecting vintage American pocket watches. From what I have gleaned so far cleaning is routinely accepted/expected in PW world, unlike US coins where that cuts value in half many times. Of course I'm not talking about COA of movements but rather faces, cases, etc.

It seems there may be an exception when dealing with pre late 19th century pieces where "patina" is treated as a desirable thing. (I like Buster's observation...where does patina end and gunk begin).

So I'm trying to be sure I know when and what to clean and then will look into good methods. I assume in all instances it is light cleaning which inflicts little or no surface damage and does not result in an unnatural coloration.

Is there a good reference source on this subject (I did see the prior pre-lim and wax discussion)?

Thx

Hello Gary....Here is just a quick result using our 'Find-Or-Search' feature at the top of any page....

Search for Cleaning & Use

There are 388 posts to look at, hope the info you want is among them....

Regards,

Jerry

Thanks Jerry, I shied away from that because I assumed it would lead me mainly to movement cleaning discussions. It does contain a lot of that, but I'm picking up some good info from both types of cleaning discussions.

I have purchased books to aid in buying good watches and one on repair. I have the desire to at least disect one and see if can actually handle the precision involved in disassembly. I bought a nice looking but non running 7j Ingersoll Reliance for $15 with shipping...I have set it aside as a first autopsy victim. Not sure I ever want to routine do COA, but I'd like to be able to do some routine work...if there is such a thing.

I figure if nothing else this will help me assess what I'm buying. Learning how to repair guitars made me a much better Guitar buyer.

In terms of my original querry, all I have read so far confirms that cleaning is no sin as long as you don't do significant damage in the process.

Hey Gary, If you want the watch to be original,then it must be clean and shiny,as it was when it was originally purchased. The cases are pretty easy to clean up. Especially the Silver,and silveroid ones,because they are not plated,and you don't have to worry about rubbing through any plating. Deep scratches can even be polished out of these type cases. If you want the watch's experience to show,then patina,dents,scratches,and maybe even as far as leaving it in a non running condition,might suffice. Some folks think that scratched crystals,and cracked and chipped dials,and a few dents,and dings add to the charm of an old watch but,personally,I like them as close as I can get them to like new condition. Just my opinion. Everyone has one.

I'm with Cecil - some folks think scars add to the tapestry of a watch, but I prefer mine as close to factory as practicable.

I'm not sure "patina" is a good thing.

If you owned a '29 Model T or something similar, I'm fairly sure you'd wash it once in a while, rather than let the patina build up.

I just think of it this way, the watches were designed to be taken apart, cleaned and repaired. Parts were sold for them when they were in widespread use. So taking them apart, cleaning ect done now is ok. Part of what drew me to this hobby was the ability to take them apart. Granted, as long as no damage is done. Whats even worse is creating a frankenwatch of mixed parts from different years and styles.
Also Cases didnt come with a lot of watches. So I personally dont mind a correct period recase. Some people do, to each their own.

I agree with everybody. When a watch pleases the eye of the collector, leave it alone. To get there do whatever you see as necssary.

I've only been collecting pocket watches for a short time but I don't believe for a second that the original owners of these beautiful time machines would ever allow them to become all grunged a crudded up with grit, dirt and "patina" while they were in use.

I find myself quite proud of my watches when I wear them occasionally and I wouldn't want anyone to say, "oh my, look at the filthy watch that man's carrying." So, to clean them is to love them.

For example, here's my Waltham 1857. Manufactured April, 1864 while General Grant was Winter Quartered at Brandy Station. As shiny (almost) as the day it came out of the factory.





That's my story and I'm stickin' to it.

Bud

The "patina" seems to result from sitting unused for many years. Frequent handling gives a watch a "polish" similar to the raised areas on a coin. I like to keep mine looking like they're not neglected.

I try to keep the watch correct (period correct dial and hands, along with case) but I fall into the cleaning crowd. Watches told the user what time it was but they were also jewelry, if not why have gold or silver cases. When I get a watch I pull the movement from the case, clean the case, pull the dial and clean the dial and put it back together. Then after that I wipe it down and put it away, I don't over clean but there is no harm in doing a good initial cleaning to remove all the years of drawer gunk, coal power gunk and some other gunk that I can't figure out what it might be.

I agree that cleaning a watch is not the same as leaving the patina on a Tiffany lamp. Cleaning a watch is restoration to be sure. When it comes to advancing the idea of bringing back a timepiece to what it once was, I faced one of those moments I can only call spiritual.
I started to switch a case because it was so damaged but the movement was perfect. As I was pulling it out, I found myself staring at all the endearing scripts, placed there long ago, some writen even before my grandfather found the nerve to ask the girl who would be my grandmother to dance.
I thought of all the watchmakers who had touched the piece, and felt as if I were commiting a crime by separating movement from case, and so I put them back together again.

I met last Monday with an old time buyer/seller of pocket watches. He had bought a Sears roebuck movement that I had on Ebay. He wanted to pick it up as he was close and down for the winter.
He had been over to Webster - A huge local flea market - . I asked him to show me what he had bought at the market. One watch was a big old silver Hampden with a raised fire truck on the back cover.
It was just dirty as heck. I told him that it would polish up beautifully. Well he liked to of had a hemorrhage, snatched it away from me and said "no, no never clean that, the patina is worth everything"
Duh! To each his own. If it were mine it would be polished.

I wonder if that guy ever bathed, choosing instead to let his "patina" build up.

Cleaning is a good thing.

On the topic of cleaning this is something I have always wonded why more ebay sellers don't take the extra 4-5 mins to at least clean the case. I have bought watches that didn't show any brass but looked like heck that once you cleaned the decades of gunk off them they look very nice. I guess I shouldn't complain too much because a lot of time these watches go well under what they should sell for. I guess it would be like having a nice old car and refuse to wash/wax it because you want the patina of age, LOL.