Greetings and salutations from Cincinnati, OH...

I recently purchased/received my first Hamilton 950 with original box. Please let me know what you think. Movement number is 2457768, Wadsworth case back number is 0495177, bezel number is E5177 and frame number is E5177.

From what I've researched here as well as via other sources, the movement number places the manufacture date at about 1927 or 1928...and the case at about 1928 via its respective number. I'm assuming that this is a jeweler cased 950 and not a factory cased 950.

I just had to have this watch...I've wanted a 950 for a while...as well as the presence of an original box...I dig the boxes. I also love the Wadsworth Model 2 case...probably one of my favorites as well as the Heavy Gothic dial which has two very light scratches [not hairlines] down low near the "7" and "8". Also, I've been able to regulate the 950 to about +4 seconds per day...so that's pretty good in my book.

This 950 will be worn once or twice a week...probably along with my 950B. Yes, I wear two pocket watches simultaneously [in different pockets]...I do this quite often with my other railroad machines...learned it from my watchmaker/clockmaker uncle back in the late 1960's/early 1970's.

This watch was serviced in September of this year prior to my purchase...my local watchmaker inspected it and states that everything looks in order servicing wise.

Quick question: I'm assuming that the frame number and the bezel number of E5177 are a shortened version of the full case number of 0495177...but what does the "E" mean?

Respectfully,

Collin

Pics...

More...

And more...

Still more...

Almost finished...

Done...

Looks like you scored a Home Run! Beautiful.
The 950 is on my list as I have the 950B.


Roger

Thanks, sir...if it is a home run...it was an expensive home run. I know I paid too much...BUT I had to have it...AND I had to have the box.

Also, I wish you well regarding your quest for a 950.

Collin

Collin, nice watch, I don't know that I could bring myself to wear it.

Regarding your question about the meaning of the "E".

The American Watch Case Co. of Toronto followed a similar procedure on their case frames using a letter and the last four digits of the case serial number.

Fortune F ####
Cashier C ####
Empress X ####

Why they did not use the first letter of Empress rather than X I will never know.

I don't think it is significant, just an identifier.

On the bezel of AWCCo cases the last four digits were usually scratched in Roman numerals.

Absolutely beautiful, but I HAVE to ask, Collin, WHY wear two watches at the same time.

I've known several old time watchmakers, some who were railroad watch inspectors back in the 60's, and none of them ever did that.

Come to think of it, I don't know ANY watch and clock maker who ever did, or does that.

Did your folks ever give you a reason, or was it just a habit?

Just curious. Not a thing wrong with the practice....it's just a new one on me.

Regards! Mark

Hi Collin,

Very nice set!!!!! I would say this is an original factory set which left the factory cased in your Model #2 case. The #2 is marked on the bottom left corner of the label and case serial numbers appear to match. I have a 950 box set like this one in a model #4 WG case.

Rob
www.pocketwatchrepairs.net

Lorne, good info...and thank you. Also, I have seen the hand scribed Roman numerals on the bezels of some of my railroad machines.

Mark, thank you, sir. Why wear two watches at the same time? It's always good to have another mechanical backup! Never mind that we have several electronic clocks on the flight deck. Pictured below is "Waltham Wednesday" at the office...with my Dad's Waltham Ruby [on a Raine Inc. band that has a retractable protective cover] and my Waltham Vanguard 1908 w/ winding indicator. From what I understand, my Uncle wore multiple watches [wrist and pocket] simultaneously to check the timing work that he had done as well as to show family members and friends at various gatherings.

Rob, thanks for the good words, sir...the movement numbers and case numbers do match up with the box numbers. Also, if able, I'd like to see pics of your 950 box set for comparison, please.

Mark...

Mark...it's always good to have another mechanical backup..."Waltham Wednesday" at the office!

My Dad's Waltham Ruby [protective cover retracted] and my Waltham Vanguard 1908 w/ winding indicator...

The Hamilton 950 is my favorite pocket. I am retired UPRR and I always carried a high grade pocket in my long sleeve shirt with button down pockets on a chain with buttonhole configuration for securing it.

I preferred the 950 in a Pendant set variation so I could set time daily with The Standard UP Clocks in the Depots without the hassle of unscrewing and removing the front bezel to do so. After 1967 the requirements for RRA/RRG went away so the pendant set which wasn't considered RRA before 1967, wasn't a requirement after 1967.

Nice addition to your collection ! I'm different than most folks, I say wear that watch and be proud of it because life is short and time waits for no man.......

Here's a couple of true beauties I sold on IHC185;

https://ihc185.infopop.cc/eve/f...333998287#2333998287

https://ihc185.infopop.cc/eve/f...773966787#6773966787

regards,
bb

quote:

I preferred the 950 in a Pendant set variation so I could set time daily with The Standard UP Clocks in the Depots. After 1967 the requirements for RRA/RRG went away so the pendant set which wasn't considered RRA before 1967, wasn't a requirement after 1967.

Buster...very interesting, sir...I did not know about the requirements for RRA/RRG going away after 1967...learn something new everyday!

quote:

Nice addition to your collection ! I'm different than most folks, I say wear that watch and be proud of it because life is short and time waits for no man.......

Thank you, sir. I have 10 railroad machines in rotation...no safe queens...they are all utilized.

quote:

Here's a couple of true beauties I sold on IHC185;

https://ihc185.infopop.cc/eve/f...333998287#2333998287

https://ihc185.infopop.cc/eve/f...773966787#6773966787

WOW! Double WOW! Those are very spiffy, Buster.

(NOTE: Some of the following is a bit "Off-Topic" but could be considered relevant.)

Collin,

Factory-Cased examples such as your 950 in Case 2 are what we used to build this database...

WADSWORTH-HAMILTON CASE NUMBERS, History, Pictures of Cases and Database of Numbers

That rather far-ranging compilation results from nearly ten years of assembling numbers from many numbered factory boxes. As explained in the data preamble we began with the Gelson List of Hamilton Movement Numbers wherein we have a year of production. Then from having accumulated numbers from each year we were able to correlate the movements with the cases and from all that we can tell with a fair degree of certainty where a case belongs.

For decades many, and I mean MANY re-sellers regularly played (and far as I know still play) "musical-movements" (like the party-game of "musical chairs") changing them around from case-to-case whenever they felt doing so would be to their financial advantage. They explained to me in face-to-face interviews, that dubious practice makes their inventory "look fresher" because they are no longer showing the same combinations the prospective buyers saw in their inventory the previous day or even earlier in the same day.

When I would try to explain we know what combinations are correct from our research they would almost invariably become upset and tell me the information we were developing should never be shared with the public, such as in a viewable by the public forum. Anger over our open sharing of information is just a small part of why in December of 2007 we separated from that "other" organization followed by their angry attempts at discrediting The Internet Horology Club, me, my family and certain of our members as retribution.

About the use of "E" before the last four digits has no definitive explanation. My thinking is the "E" being the 5th letter of the alphabet could be code standing for it being the 5th place from the end of the case number followed by the last four digits as in 5,4,3,2,1 represented as E,4,3,2,1 counting down. We see this pretty reliably on Wadsworth Cases but each company had their own codes, unfortunately none of the codes were ever published so all we have on codes like that C-8" is our speculation.

By the way, in a previous topic you shared a Star Case 17 (housing a 950B from mid-1960s [we have 950B number S29403 and it is documented as 1965] near-end-of-production. Unfortunately the case and dial are both earlier.) with a RED rubber-stamped "C-5" inside the case-back. We have no way to determine what that meant and likely we never will, there are no remaining Star records and no statements from or interviews with contemporary employees have surfaced. All we can tell you is collectors place a value-premium on having a red rubber-stamped coded number so resist the urge to clean it off from the inside case-back.

Some things we have figured out through diligent research, some others we likely never will figure out.

Keep sharing by posting!

Lindell

quote:

All we can tell you is collectors place a value-premium on having a red rubber-stamped coded number so resist the urge to clean it off from the inside case-back.

Yes, sir! I can attest I had no urge to clean the red rubber-stamped code of "C-8" from the inside case-back of my 950B.

Also, the database reference material that you posted is what I've been referencing...so a sincere "THANKS!" goes out to all involved regarding the gathering and availabilty of that information here.

Collin

AH, now THAT makes sense! I forgot you were a pilot! Of course!

Thanks!

Regard! Mark

quote:

By the way, in a previous topic you shared a Star Case 17 (housing a 950B from mid-1960s [we have 950B number S29403 and it is documented as 1965] near-end-of-production. Unfortunately the case and dial are both earlier.) with a RED rubber-stamped "C-5" inside the case-back.

Sir, just to confirm regarding my 950B...so the Star case number of R978194 and #332 dial are both earlier than the 950B movement number of S29333?

Additional pic with reference to previous post...

quote:

About the use of "E" before the last four digits has no definitive explanation. My thinking is the "E" being the 5th letter of the alphabet could be code standing for it being the 5th place from the end of the case number followed by the last four digits as in 5,4,3,2,1 represented as E,4,3,2,1 counting down. We see this pretty reliably on Wadsworth Cases but each company had their own codes, unfortunately none of the codes were ever published so all we have on codes like that "C-8" is our speculation.

Very good info...sounds logical...thank you, sir!

Collin here are some quick shots. Boxes are the same.

Rob
www.pocketwatchrepairs.net

pic 2

movement

label

case

quote:

Collin here are some quick shots. Boxes are the same.

Mr. Carter...so very nice...so very nice!

Thanks for posting the pics, sir.

Collin

Here's a question regarding the care/storage of my 950's box: What would be recommended to preserve it?

Currently I have it wrapped in watchmaker's paper and have it placed in a slightly larger [internally padded] cardboard box where no shifting occurs inside...which all goes in the home safe. I would think that wrapping the 950's box directly in plastic would not be good.

Watchmaker's paper...

That is really nice Collin , the only trouble with having 2 watches is that if they differ you can never really be sure what time it is !, and Buster has sold some real beauties through here , I have been lucky enough to get one { an Illinois } If he sell's those beauties I can only wonder at what he keeps ! Rob that is a nice one , would love to be able to buy one for 105 dollars !

Segal's law states:

"A man with a watch knows what time it is. A man with two watches is never sure."

quote:

Segal's law states:

"A man with a watch knows what time it is. A man with two watches is never sure."

Thanks, Kevin! And yes, Kevin and Steven...I do agree with not knowing the correct time if wearing two watches...SO...the dude [yes, that's me pictured below with my 992, 992E and 992B] that wears three watches is probably even more confused.

Gee whiz...what time is it???