Just got back my 1872 New York Watch Co., Geo. Sam. Rice model, from servicing only to find the once flawless dial now missing chips all along the perimeter. I couldn't believe it. It never had so much as a hairline before it went in. Can anything be done?

Thanks,
Dana

Dana,

Could the dial have been switched? Did they have a response? Who did the work?

Steve

Steve-

A local watch guy I've known for years did the work and claimed it came of cleaning solution that way. I never even considered it could have been switched.

Dana

Dana,

I have cleaned hundreds of dials using Comet bathroom cleaner and I have never had any bad outcomes. I wonder if he used an aggressive cleaner in an ultrasonic cleaner or something.

Steve

Dana, Can you post any "before" and "after" pictures of this situation?

Not taking sides either way here, but just personal opinion. There are times when the best handling in the world can't prevent unexpected things from happening when servicing a watch. Especially watches that are 50, 75, 100 years old or more. I can't speculate what may have happened here, but if this is a person who you have known for years, I expect you probably have had other work done by him. If he has been honest with you in the past I doubt he would stoop to switching dials. If he performed his work in a professional manner, in a generally accepted way of handling the dial and this happened, it may very well be that there was some other underlying cause that you and he will never know. There are risks and benefits to any procedure, whether it be medical or mechanical.

Images

The movement

This dial is ruined and the watchmaker who did it owes you a replacement.

I wonder if someone put this movement in the cleaning machine with the dial still on it, or perhaps the dog chewed on it.

I sorta fit the mold of Roger on this one for many of the same reasons....

Dana, I'm wondering if the dial had been repaired,professionally, at some point in it's life and without knowing this had been, when someone attempted to 'clean' the dial, they inadvertently 'undone' what had been repaired prior...?

Just a thought....

Regards,
Jerry

Jerry-

I cleaned the dial the night before it went in for servicing. It was flawless. Any repairs would have had to have been done at the quantum level.

Dana

I agree with Ed. The only way I can imagine edge chip damage like that being done to a dial is by putting it in one of the spinner-type cleaning machines and having it knock into other parts as it agitates them.
Mike

One thing that crossed my mind is I wonder where the dial feet are, if its tight he have been leavering away and not noticing what was going on possibly holding it face covered in watch tissue to protect the dial....

The most troubling part of the story is that he made no mention of the mangled dial when I picked up the watch. I didn't have my glasses with me at the time. The dial looks pretty good without my glasses. How much value is lost with a destroyed dial?

Dana

I would estimate the losses suffered are at least 1/2 the value of the watch, PLUS 200% of the watch repair person's "fee" to cause these horrible damages.

So, as a "1 star rare" New York Watch Co. of Springfield (predecessor to Hampden/Hamilton, etc., etc.) Geo Sam Rice "lists" at $300.00 which is actually 1/2 its true value, a loss of 200% of the watchmaker's fee, plus $300.00, has to be (to me) somewhere around $500.00.

These are pinned dials that are very easy to remove and replace even with my large and inexperienced hands. The chips on this dial are fresh evidence which a trained professional watchmaker has no excuse to cause, period!

Your best basis for any claim to this damage would rest on your having pictures of this dial before you turned it over to be cleaned and serviced.

That said, we need to look for a dial. btw, this watchmaker should ne added to the "Conan the Barbarian watchmaker no go list"

In regards to Chris' question, the book shows the dial feet should be at 14.0, 36.4, & 51.9

Also are my eyes playing tricks on me or is there some red color near the damage at the 23 minute damage mark?

Tom

David-

Now I feel even worse. It was one of those watches you find that looked like it was bought and never used. The only good thing is that I got it for a good price ($154). If I add in the $160 for service, I guess it could be worse.

Dana

I see it too Tom and also at the 13 min. mark....

Looks like this guy did battle or something....

I agree with Dave's assesment of 'Conan The Barbarian' watchmaker no go list, however, this dosen't help Dana any at this point....

Dana, do you have any pics of the 'Before' nature...? It will help when you try to gain some kind of value for the damage done....

What size is the watch that we need to be looking for this dial...?

Regards,
Jerry

Gentlemen-

That could be the blood from slashing my wrists after seeing the dial under magnification. I've had good experiences with this guy for years. I never felt the need to take "before' pictures but I guess I was wrong. The watch is 18s,KW,HC.

Thanks for your help.

Dana

My first post on this topic was made before the picture of the dial was put up. From the looks of the dial, it appears he did not perform his work in a professional manner, in a generally accepted way of handling the dial. Since you have had success with this individual before and have been happy, maybe he simply made an error. We are all human. It is how he handles the mistake that should determine future dealings with the individual. Some of the posters here are ready to throw him under the bus and banish him from ever touching a watch again. Those without sin may cast the first stones. I know I couldn't throw one. Personal opinions so take them for what they are worth to you.

Roger, I have to agree with you. As Chris Abell reminded me several times when I cry on his shoulder about some dismal discovery; "we all make mistakes". I had a similar experience with one of our members here, and they sent me three new dials to choose from to make up for the one damaged.

The fact remains that IF this person did that damage to the dial, the very least they should do is tell the client what happened. It is a simple honesty thing.

As for the "redness", that is evidence of how fresh the damage done is as it is the copper substrate of the dial which will turn dark green soon after being in the case for awhile.

David and Roger-

Since I seem to recall doing some unspeakable things to unsuspecting dials in the past, I pretty much agree with you. If I had been told up front that something had gone wrong, it would have made a world of difference. Maybe I need to send a watch (see post on missing screw) to Chris or David to restore my faith.

Dana

Dana & David, Yes, I agree that honesty is the key ingredient here. Hopefully the gentleman will fall on his sword and make things right.