Today, I discovered this just in time . . . (ebay# 280339291564 ) . . . I wonder how many true Montgomery dials there are on 16s W.I. Elgins . . .

The serial number 17871319 shows it is a VERY EARLY grade 372 . . .

Search Results For "17871319"
Serial Number SN Range RunQty Name Year grade size code jewels Adj/reg/etc.
-------------- -------- ------ ---- ---- ----- ---- ------ ------ ------------
17871319 17871001 1000 BWR 1913 372* 16s o3n15l 19j A5P r jb


grade total runs first yr last yr class size code jewels Adj/name
----- ----- ----- -------- ------- ----- ---- ------ ------ ----------
372 35700 36 1909 1917 98 16s o3n15l 19j A5P / BWR

(*) notes on grade 372: first 16s w/WI option


Class 98: 16s OF 3/4 lever
270 12000 made model 9 bridge 21j Adj Marked 270 or VER. est num produced VER: 3450 270: 8550
350 1000 made model 13 23j Adj Marked VER.
360 1000 made model 13 21j Adj Marked VER.
372 35700 made model 15 19j A5P Marked BWR.
374 11000 made model 15 21j A5P Marked FT.
375 4000 made model 15 21j A5P Marked VER or FT. not sure which naming is more common
388 19000 made model 15 21j A5P Marked FT.
391 9000 made model 15 21j A5P Marked BWR or FT.



NO MENTION OF W.I.

Now, we have to dig deeper into the research section of the Elgin database (Just add space v=9 after the serial number so as in this case I enter "17871319 v=9") and the truth be known


Search Results For "17871319 v=9"
Serial Number SN Range RunQty Name Year grade size code jewels Adj/reg/etc.
-------------- -------- ------ ---- ---- ----- ---- ------ ------ ------------
17871319 17871001 1000 BWR 1913 372* 16s o3n15l 19j A5P r jb
# SN17871242 said to be "BWR 19j A5P" and WI on www.miles-pocketwatches.com/PageEL140.html
# SN17871064 seen as "BWR 19j A5P" and WI on ebay 1644719925



grade total runs first yr last yr class size code jewels Adj/name
----- ----- ----- -------- ------- ----- ---- ------ ------ ----------
372 35700 36 1909 1917 98 16s o3n15l 19j A5P / BWR

(*) notes on grade 372: first 16s w/WI option
# 1915 MC "Grade of Mvt" list implies possible marking: BWR(1)
# seen advertised as BWR in "Bogle Brothers" JC in EWC pg 87
# SN17539468 seen as "BWR 19j A5P" on ebay 198290905
14472001
# SN14472069 has no mention of a marking in the Ritchie logs, but the meaning is unclear
15724001 is there something "funny" about this run? the 1915 MC shows the next run marked as "372r"
16308001 1915 MC shows grade as "372r", maybe this is a BWR?
# SN16308674 seen as "BWR 21j" (pic too blury to tell much else) on ebay 1678969626
16408001 is there something "funny" about this run? the 1915 MC shows the previous run marked as "372r"
# SN16408370 has no mention of a marking in the Ritchie logs, but the meaning is unclear
16970001
# SN16970876 seen as "BWR 19j A5P" and WI on ebay 383823526
17065001
# SN17065864 seen as "BWR 19j A5P WI" on ebay 328329597
17698001
# SN17698904 seen as WI on ebay 139756776
# SN176984?? seen as WI on ebay 248755189
# SN17698450 seen as WI on ebay 274242347
# SN17698461 seen as WI on ebay 324471226
# SN17698915 seen as WI on ebay 379353666
17822001
# SN17822544 seen as WI on ebay 238004377
17871001
# SN17871242 said to be "BWR 19j A5P" and WI on www.miles-pocketwatches.com/PageEL140.html
# SN17871064 seen as "BWR 19j A5P" and WI on ebay 1644719925
20145001
# SN20145007 seen as "BWR 19j A5P" and WI on ebay 390071880



Class 98: 16s OF 3/4 lever
270 12000 made model 9 bridge 21j Adj Marked 270 or VER. est num produced VER: 3450 270: 8550
350 1000 made model 13 23j Adj Marked VER.
360 1000 made model 13 21j Adj Marked VER.
372 35700 made model 15 19j A5P Marked BWR.
374 11000 made model 15 21j A5P Marked FT.
375 4000 made model 15 21j A5P Marked VER or FT. not sure which naming is more common
388 19000 made model 15 21j A5P Marked FT.
391 9000 made model 15 21j A5P Marked BWR or FT.


Elgin did not add much detail, but some Grade 372 runs were made with a countable number of W.I. equipped movements!


These were ALSO among the very first 16s W.I. AND WITH 19 Jewel BWR movements made with a Jeweled Motor Barrel . . . So now I gotta find the watch hour hand that Elgin used on the W.I. Staff . . . probably have to re-staff this guy too.

More when it arrives.

David nice watch i like the dial,don,t see many with a monty dial..Hope the indicator gears are okay that little tiny transfer gear is a hard item too find.

I've got one! It meant the mortgage payment, but it was worth it.

SN 34766826, 16s BWR.

This arrived today, and after I re-staffed it the little BWR "runs like a charm". Also, I found a "perfect fit" Elgin wristwatch hand that fitted right on the W.I. Staff. Next, I gotta clean it.

What's that hole between the SN and the winding wheel?

I wondered about that hole too, more to come when I get this apart for cleaning. I may need some parts, as the W.I. is not "indicating". As it is a planetary gear thing, it could just be dirty, more on that too.

Other than that the watch is running very very well. I look forward to getting it to RR spec after cleaning.