Internet Horology Club 185
Montgomery Dial [see explanation]

This topic can be found at:
https://ihc185.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/1086047761/m/6773992097

August 07, 2017, 15:31
Derek Ramsdale
Montgomery Dial [see explanation]
This is quite a rare Montgomery dial with the minutes either side of the line & every 5th. minute in red. I`ve only seen pictures of this type of dial & all minutes were in black.

[ADMINISTRATOR'S CLARIFICATION: No, that is not a Montgomery Patent Dial as explained later in this topic]


August 07, 2017, 15:35
Derek Ramsdale
And its complimenting a lovely `92`model Railroader.


August 07, 2017, 16:55
Steven Ford
Total made 260 Total runs 4
Start Jan 1900 End Feb 1902
First 7489801 Last 7489850
Model 1892 Name Railroader
Grade Railroader Material P
Size 18
Plate FP
Jewels 17
Balance Ex Bal Pat. Reg. - Breg. HS
Style OF

A rare bird indeed!!
August 07, 2017, 19:44
Roger Stephens
Very Nice!!

Roger
August 07, 2017, 20:11
Gary E. Cochran
Awesome Watch...
August 07, 2017, 23:04
Bila Wirriganwalters
Beautiful watch, a lovely example as is the dial, just to be correct though that dial is a marginal minutes dial not a MontgomerySmile
August 08, 2017, 05:55
Derek Ramsdale
Thanks Steven & Bila. To tell the truth I was finding it difficult to obtain details of that type of dial.
August 08, 2017, 11:50
Lindell V. Riddle

BILA IS RIGHT, NOT A MONTGOMERY DIAL, NOT EVEN THE RIGHT DIAL

In January of this year we discussed a complete Model 1892 Waltham Railroader with the
correct dial and the seller erroneously claiming only 17 of these were made! That example
7489983 after having been listed three times finally sold for $1,750.00 so they are around.

Here, Railroader Movement 7489835 is exactly like and closely numbered to Derek's watch.
(Waltham Railroader in the next two images posted on IHC by Mike Valek July 16th 2007)

Model 1892 Waltham marked as "Railroader" Movement...


August 08, 2017, 11:50
Lindell V. Riddle

To be complete a "Railroader" movement must front a marked as "Railroader" dial.
Below, Mike Valek's entirely correct original "Railroader" dial on number 7489835
completes the theme of this very beautiful watch. Like all the Ball Brotherhoods,
South-Bend Polaris, Santa-Fe Route, and others dial must match the movement.

The late Ed Parsons: "Without the matching dial you have only half a watch."

Model 1892 Waltham REAL-DEAL "Railroader" Matching Dial...


August 08, 2017, 11:50
Lindell V. Riddle

Here is a suggestion...

This style of dial that Waltham called "Rail-Road" available in Single and Double-Sunk
5 Minute Outer Track could serve as a way to come a little closer to what would be the
ultimate, but nearly impossible goal of locating an available signed as "Railroader" dial.

This is what I would do for now, to me this step is a no-brainer! Wink


August 08, 2017, 11:50
Lindell V. Riddle

And so we move to the dial we saw above on Derek's number 7489815 which is a design
largely unrecognized by most modern day collectors. It is important to recognize exactly
what that dial is and even more importantly, to realize what it is not.

In his post above in this topic Bila pointed out he did not feel that "Montgomery" properly
described the dial in question, and yes he was right on track.

Bila's sharp eye Eek proves to be on the target.

That dial presently on 7489815 is in fact a "Fitch Patent Dial" as the late
Ed Parsons explained in a July of 2013 posting with a picture of the dial design...

_______________________________________________


"This unusual numerical dial was patented by Ezra C. Fitch, longtime president of
Waltham Watch Co. (1883-1921). I think the idea was that by separating odd and
even minute numerals onto two marginal minute tracks, it would be possible to
make them larger and easier to read.

I just find it confusing, as I suspect many others did back in the day, because
these dials are quite uncommon today."

Edward L. Parsons, Jr.

________________________________________________


Examining Fitch Patent Dials in our collection the center of them is more like a 10 or 12-size
dial and the outer track is something I do find difficult and as Ed said, confusing to read.
Frankly I really must tell you, the more I look at it the more my head aches!

But none other than Webb C. Ball took it somewhat further as only Ball could, calling this dial...

"Freakish, confusing, hard to read and so distracting as to be downright dangerous."

That leaves nothing to the imagination, Ball was not one to mince words!


Fitch Patent Dial from Edward L. Parsons Jr. in 2013 posting...


August 08, 2017, 11:50
Lindell V. Riddle

CLICK FOR:

"Montgomery Dials"

Henry S. Montgomery History and information.
August 08, 2017, 11:51
Lindell V. Riddle

Always use the IHC "Find-Or-Search" feature to find more information...

It may take some digging around and sorting through, but the information IS there!

Lindell

Wink