Recently I sold two watches;
Hamilton 16s Railroad 972 5adj Contract Signed A.G. Page; s/n; 724604
Hamilton 16s 974 Movement Signed "Limited" ; s/n; 1654115

To someone who lives at;
10xxx E County Road A
Janesville, WI 53546

The post office reported their successful delivery to that residence on Sept 23, and the buyer started a dispute saying that he never recieved the watches, so eBay notified me;

"Transaction date: Sep 21, 2009
Transaction amount: $383.00 USD
Your transaction ID: 9WC9798952339402R
Case number: PP-798-528-688
Your Transaction ID:9WC9798952339402R
Buyer's Transaction ID:9JP09938RK673301Y
Disputed Amount: -$383.00 USD- The disputed amount has been temporarily
deducted from your account until the dispute is resolved."

That is double jeopardy. I sell two watches, the post office records their delivery and the buyer denies their receipt so I lose the watches and the payment!

So these watches are . . . in my opinion . . .STOLEN!

If you are looking at Hamiltons, The names "A G Page", and "Limited" are both sigficantly unusual.

Please left me know if you find anything. Details to follow, the 974;NOT

Other details 974 Limited;

The 972 A.G. Page;

More 972 A.G. Page;

Dave,

I am really sorry to hear about the theft of your watches and though I never look at Hamilton listings I can offer no more than some sympathetic support. I do not understand how the PO can say they were delivered but ebay sides with the buyer. The dispute should be with ebay, the seller, and the Post Master General. Somewhere the system broke down and it was not because of you. I hope this gets settled and you get your money.

Steve

David...I recently had something similar happen to me. Ebay/Paypal hijacks your money until the "dispute" is resolved. I think once you provide your delivery confirmation, your funds will be restored. Mine were, but I was extremely annoyed about the hijack of my funds in the first place. Good luck with your situation. I hope it gets resolved quickly for you.

Roger

Sorry to hear about the losss Dave If I remember over $200 you need a signature to meet the many PayPal requirements, was it insured you may be able to claim from USPS

David,

Years ago I had a similar experience where the seller claimed he did not recieve the item.

Fortunately for me , his wife had emailed me the day before complimenting me on the sturdy packaging.

Its scary out there.

Good luck.

Bill

David as long as you have delivery confirmation you will not lose Geno

All the more reason to promote our member auctions.

It stretches credibility that the buyer or someone with familiar access to the mailbox did not remove these watches.

Dave, I feel confident your money will be refunded by Paypal. It's just this "guilty" first label that is so unpalatable.

I had a similar situation once when I returned a watch to a dealer and he claimed he never received it. Luckily, when I checked with the post office he had signed for it. His signature on record. He apologized and refunded my money.

Steve

Anytime you insure something over $200.00 with the post office, someone has to sign for it.
As far as eBay hijacking your paypal account, that's another reason I don't do paypal.

If I were a seller on eBay, which I am not, I would not ship anything without insurance because a signature is required in order for it to be left as being delivered....that is according to my postman of 20 years....

If the post office, in this case, only has record of it being delivered to that 'residence', without a signature....uh oh....I only hope there is a signature....

Sorry this had to happen David and I will keep a lookout for these two items....I remember seeing them when you had them at auction....

Good Luck....

Jerry

HELLO DAVE,
I HAVE HAD SOMETHING LIKE THIS HAPPEN TO ME TWICE. GET ON THE HORN WITH EBAY AND TELL THEM ALL ,WHICH IM SURE YOU HAVE AND WHEN THEY HAVE FINISHED THIER SO CALLED INVESTAGATION THEY WILL PUT YOUR MONEY BACK IN YOUR ACCOUNT. I GOT IT BACK EACH TIME. ONE OF MINE WAS SHIPPED OVERSEAS.
HANG IN THERE !
LEONARD

Thank You Leonard, and Lindell. I just recieved an email from the buyer;

David,
"I sent the "dipute closed" e-mail to paypal. I received the watches today and they both are in good shape and running. Thank you for your patience. The post office had delivered the package to the wrong address and that person had been out of town until a couple of days ago. I hope that they will put the money back in your account soon.
Thank you,
Rob"

As I failed to insure this shipment, it could have been an expensive lesson. From now on anything over the $250.00 "ceiling" that eBay imposed ( Thanks for the time you spent finding that out Lindell ), I will required a signature on delivery and/or insure each shipment.

Dave...Glad it all worked out. It's too bad ebay hijacks funds like that. They are so big they can do whatever they please. They pretty much have a monopoly with online auctions. Their dispute policy needs serious revision. Think what ebay can do with millions of hijacked dollars in their account even for a week or two. I bet interest alone on that money can add up to a tidy sum.

Roger

Dave,
Glad it worked out for you. From now on, I wouldn't sell a stem on eBay, unless the buyer is going to pay for insurance.
Brian C.

Dave - great news! So glad this has been resolved and hope you get your Paypal money back ASAP.

What bothers me, in addition to Paypal's "the seller is always wrong and the buyer is always right" policy, is that the post office noted in their system that the package had been delivered to the buyer's address when in fact it had been delivered to the wrong place. Major error on their part.

Going forward with a signature requirement is the way to go to avoid situations like this.

Lindell, The one good thing in all of this is that the buyer also (as I always have done) got an IHC185 card and invite to join us, which I hope this person takes advantage of. Thank you all for being there.

There are some good folks out there afterall....

Glad to know that everything worked out for you Dave....Like my momma would say (God Bless Her), "All's well that ends well"....

One last thing, in line with one of Lin's statements above, "Learn the Rules, then Play the Game"....

Regards,
Jerry

Another thought on this which I learned the hard way is if you sell multiple watches to the same buyer and the total of the watches is valued over $250 then you must have a signature also. I sold several lower end watches to a buyer not thinking since they were all about $40-$60 watches I only put a delivery confirmation. The buyer opened a dispute and I showed the delivery confirmation which showed he received them but I lost because the Total of the watches were over $250. Hard lesson but one I never forgot.