I picked up a Hamilton 927 Hunter #543354 (1907) with a Ferguson Dial.

Watch runs really well, haven't got the cojones to pull the dial to see what is on the back. I think I will wait till I find a proper hour hand and get my guy Ralph to do it.

Tough to nail a good pic of the movement so I took it from 2 angles. Gilded trim package.

Dial close-up.

Re-cased in an OF Base Metal Defiance case from the 30's

Lorne, Comparing yours it to the later style Ferguson that Ed Parsons posted with his Ball 18s 19J Hamilton which also has that Hour hand style. I think the red Hour hand is meant to reduce confusion reading "Ferguson Time" and it may well be the minute hand on yours needs matching to the hour hand. (They both look fine to me).

Also, your Ferguson dial is somewhat different and may be very unique to the history of that design.

Dave, from what I have been able to find out the original hour hand was red to match the hours and the minute black to match the minutes.

I think the hour hand on mine is original, some of the paint is chipped off, but finding a real minute hand could be difficult.

The only hands I am aware of that closely match are the black Hamilton 24 hour hands Wanted to Buy or Trade and the Illinois blue which I am guessing is on Ed's watch.

The ad is from a 1913 catalogue.

That's right Lorne, a Canadian minutes hand would be your best bet and you should be able to repaint the hours hand -- Cool "PAT.APPD.FOR" dial too!

Very nice Lorne!!As Dave said, that nice looking dial is different,and may be a "missing link".I've seen lots of Ferguson dials in pictures, but have never seen one like that,that style looks way better than the usual ones to me.( no offense to the owners of regular Ferguson dialed watches!)I like it.That's yet another reason why this hobby is so addictive,every time you think you've seen it all, something like this turns up.Best regards, Ted.

The movement was completed and sold on the same day, May 25-1907, to C.H. Knights & Co.

There is a used C.H. Knights Wholesale Jewelers Price List Catalogue on Amazon from 1878, but that is all the info. Does anyone know where this Co. was located? Edit, located in Chicago.

The patent date on the back of other dials is Nov. 17-1908 so that is consistent with this pre-patent dial.

Another interesting thing I just noticed is how the marginal minutes track goes 0 to 9 and then starts over every 10 minutes instead of 1 to 60 like a conventional MM dial. That's a bit confusing when you first look at it, but kind of cool once you understand, as are the peculiar minute and hour tracks of Ferguson dials.

That is exactly my point, the 0-9 cyclic outer chapter markings are quite unique to this dial. It would be interesting to see if this variant was detailed in the Ferguson design patent.

This odd cyclic number chapter came to my attention somewhere in the watch books I have read, but I have been unable to relocate it.

Another thing about Lorne's dial, There's no Hamilton name on it.Don't most Ferguson dials have the watch company name on it, like the one Ed has?

That's the way the older-style "circular" signature Ferguson dials were. Lorne's dial with "PAT.APPD.FOR" under the center post is the earliest version. After Mr. Ferguson got his patent, that was replaced by "PATENTED" under the center post and the watch company names were added (see photo), and then came the later style "linear" signature.


Early 18-Size Ferguson-Waltham Dial with Correct Hands

Here's the later, "linear" style Ferguson signature, this time on an 18-size Ferguson-Elgin. The watch is a 21-jewel No. 349 (movement #13329014, circa 1908).

Without words:

Excellent Gerald!

I looked but was unable to find it.

There seem to be 4 different types:

1. FERGUSON DIAL PAT. APPD. FOR

2. FERGUSON DIAL PATENTED

3. FERGUSON DIAL U.S. PAT. 11-17-08

I am not sure of the chronology of 2&3 but all three were in a circle.

I have seen a pic of a #3 with HOWARD placed in a linear fashion above the circle. Unable to use the image but can be seen using google images.

4. FERGUSON DIAL
+PATENTED+
FOR-XXXXX-WATCH

Same as the dial on Ed's watch

Thanks Debbie.

I have read elsewhere that some of the earlier Ferguson dials were made in the U.S.

That then makes me wonder who made them and if they were of a quality that would stand up to Lindell's method of cleaning to remove hairlines.

I would hate to damage the dial while cleaning but will approach it gingerly.

Speaking of damage I was going to have my watch guy remove it but want to see what, if anything, is printed on the back so I will take it off later today.

So Lorne, what was printed on the back?

Mike, I am presently without camera.

The back of the dial has, written by hand, Hamil.

It took a few minutes to figure it out as the top of the Ha was removed when they cut out the seconds bit.

Then the tumblers clicked into place. It's on a Hamilton 927.

I'll put up a pic when I can.

I have found one other photo of the same dial and am presently trying to contact the guy to see if he has any further info.

FERGUSON DIAL PAT. APPD. FOR

Back view

Close-up: Hamil.

That's really a nice find. Good looking dial! The "Hamil" designation was because of feet location I would imagine.

So in say 1906-07 would this dial fit all 18s Hamiltons?

Yup!