While the feeling prevails among many "Pocket Watchers" that Elgins good designs were done by impolrted "Ex-Waltham Watchers", I think most of the "better design" Elgin watches came from a perfectly good design staff Elgin must have developed to be so indredibly productive with their first 10 million watches.
The Elgin innovators advantage is clear when working on the uniquely "Improved" Elgin Model 8 18 size movement. This Elgin is better for two reasons than Waltham's 1892 movement. Reason #1, Elgin had 6 or 8 years to design this AFTER the Waltham was Introduced.
Reason #2, Unlike Waltham's barrel bridge only plate design of the 1892 model, Elgin was already well into splitting bridgework so that 1 or two train wheels were on the barrel bridge, making service a much simpler task.
Both watches are uniquely 19th century design improvements over the "conventional" 18 size full plate designs which make them both some of the finest timepieces ever made for general public consumption.

I have a very deep love of these Elgin's of which you speak! The first RR watch I was introduced to was a 1907 18s, 19j, B.W. Raymond, that my Father in law has.
Must be the most beautiful movement I have ever seen. I know the 16s version of that watch, I own, comes apart and goes together like butter! I will not mess too much with the 18s heirloom, but I did find a dial exactly like the original, needed for his,due to damage of the original, after 2 yrs of hunting, and installed it. Now it is truly spectacular to me!
And more than a "plug watch" as he thought of it, till I was finished with the restoration.
I am glad to see there are Elgin Comrades here for me to speak with!
Regards,

Hear Hear! I admire the Elgin innovations all the way to their grade 760 AND 761 "Durabalance" Free-Sprung Wristwatches with the ONLY U.S.-Made full swing automatic winding system and 23 Jewel B.W. Raymond Durabalance equipped watches were the LAST legitimate "wind-up" RR certifiable timepiece on the US Made market. The 760-61 automatics were developed by Elgin using the same "sprague clutch" designh that had become immensly popular with the GM Hydramatic transmissions!
Unfortunately people gravitated to the "new" electrics, leaving Elgin in the wings.

...electronics don't tick.
They do usually keep better time, though. I am willing to miss a few seconds, or gain them, for personalities sake! I love the fact that no two watches sound the same. My wife didn't believe me until we were at home one night, and I told her I could tell her which of my watches were what...a blindfold and 30 minutes later, and she was convinced! And no, I didn't cheat, LOL.
As to the last comment, I still have a lot to learn, and read before I am up to speed on all the different models, but I am getting there. At least my vocabulary has grown enough toknow what people are taling about...now for the differet models. I will need a cheat sheet, I am sure!
Regards,