One of the private threads got diverted onto the Premier Maximus and it got me to wondering about the production runs of these watches.

One of the reports in the Waltham Serial Number Database is the Model and Grade Report. The Model and Grade for 1908 and Max returns a total of 4 runs with 3 different names because of inconsistent entries in the Gray Book.

The first run is 201 watches because the first Premier Maximus was 17,000,000 instead of 17000001. There followed a run of 1,000 at 17,057,001 and then 2 runs of 200 watches that I have never seen examples. The run at 17,083,501 is indicated to be hunting case while the run at 23,100,001 is indicated to be "1912 WI." The records generally list all these watches except the one big run just as "Maximus" and also lists all the Riverside Maximus as just Maximus. This allows for possible confusion, but so far all the 1908 model Maximus watches I have seen are Premier Maximus and all the 1899 model watches listed as Maximus are Riverside Maximus.

If anyone has, or has seen a watch from one of the later runs of 200, I would love to know about it.

Here is a watch from the first run and Lindell posted one from the second run with English provenance in the other thread.

Kent and I have S/N 17,083,675 listed in our database as being a HC Riverside Maximus. pendant set, marked "Adjusted" and having a Lossier Innerterminal hairspring.
This particular watch was located in England, but we have no data on its history.
The 14 examples in the 23,100,001 to 23,100,200 are all listed as being Riverside Maximus wind indicators. All have the Lossier hairspring. The only other watches anywhere in the 23,100,XXX series are two 23 jewel Vanguards (Model 1908) that are in the 23,100,4XX range.
We have 11 examples of the Premier Maximus in the run starting at 17,000,000; all are in the first 201 numbers in that range. This appears to be correctly identified as a run of 201 units.
We have 15 examples of the Premier Maximus starting at 17,057,001, but ALL are between 001 and 297, so I suspect that this run was limited to 300 units. These are the only Premier Maximus examples we have in the database, so based on examples seen (at least by us) total Premier Maximus production seems to be 501 units. Documentation of examples outside of these ranges would expand that ETP figure.

Thanks Ed. I have been thinking of editing the name of the 1899 Maximus to Riv Max since I was pretty sure that was what they were. It looks like from your recordings that the "odd" runs of 1908 Maximus are also Riv Max and should be edited as well.

Do you have the examples that Carl Goetz collected in your serial number database?

Are any of the Riv Max in the 17,057,001 run wind indicators?

Tom,
The 17,057,XXX movements are all Premier Maximus grade and are all wind indicators. We have no examples of any Riverside Maximus movememts in that range.
The only Riverside Maximus wind indicators we have listed are 19,403,001 to 100 (Model 1899) and 23,11,001 to 200 (Model 1908). There is one example of the 1899 and 14 of the 1908 listed.
I don't think we have the Goetz numbers in our database.

Does anyone know of a Premier Maximus with a KEW certificate?

Clint, I have never seen a certificate. I don't know if the WGC has one or not.

Ed, May I infer that no watches above 300 in 17,057,xxx have shown up?

Have the 1899 WI been disassembled to identify the wind indicator mechanism? Is the lever at 11:00? It seems to me that the identification of models between 1899 and 1908 may be imprecise.

Tom,
You are correct. We have no examples in the database between 17,057,301 and 17,058,000.