Last summer, a friend sent me a "Swap Meet Special" they got "for a few bucks". I first noted the unusual "Swissy" black dial with no name. (This is a litle fuzzy cause my Camera keeps trying to focus on its reflection!)

On opening, I found a Coin Silver Cased and running 13 Jewel early 16s Elgin model 5 movement with a "partial" regulator. Looked like a missing Gooseneck regulator spring.

During a little more inspection now, I see that the regulator IS complete! I have no references showing an Elgin with this type of microregulator, but there it is in real life. A clever hidden (under the Balance Cock) spring-loaded regulator arm with a pin descending through the cock to contact the spring, and a micro adjusting screw sitting out in plain sight, the only evidence that this was considered a "little above the average" watch work!

So, I will carefully disassemble this and go through it from "stem to stern" and report more on what it shows us. As I can find nothing in the references about this regulator design, I open the question; Does anybody in 185 have a model 5 Elgin with this type of regulator, or any clue what it is?

Dave,
I believe you might have hit it when you said, clever hidden spring loaded regulator. My money is on someone might have added this, maybe in a school? I have never seen one of these before and it does look strange.
Brian C.

Brian, On this watch if it was school work, they did a heckuva engraving job around the adjusting screw mount. The interesting thing is that Elgin actually lists a part number and picture for this grade movement and regulator spring. I looked it up in my Elgin factory parts file at home. I also noticed a similar under-cock mounted spring on a few of my 18s Elgin with the "customary Micro-Regulator".

Further research into this model and its s/n28867989 confirmed that this watch according to Elgin is a grade 106, and that translates to a "class 30" gilded 16s, 5th model pendant setting 15 Jewel watch. The Elgin parts book pictures a cat. #826 regulator spring that is used on the class 30 watch. To check what this watch has, I removed the Balance Cock, and the hidden regulator spring is a cat.#826!
Anyone who suspects this is "not correct", the Elgin parts cat. pic. is from the top side viewed down, while the picture of the part mounted in the cock is the "flip" side as viewed from the bottom up. A brief study of the parts extending through the top of the balance cock will show how this clever little thing is put together.
So this is indeed a legitimate Elgin product all the way through! Now the question is, since few of us knew about it, how "rare" might this be?!

The actual part

Dave,
You learn something every day in this business. I looked through my parts and found the box with the picture of the # 826 regulator spring, and the box was empty. I can't remember ever seeing one of these, but I'm young yet.
Brian C.

In looking at this Regulator setup I am amazed at the extra parts and work;
#826 Spring Body with
Spring mounted Whip Connect Stud
Spring Mounted Cock alignment pin
Blued Assembly Screw
Stud cl. hole Drilled Whip Regulator assembly
Regulator adjustment screw
Additional drilling Tapping and slotting ops to fine hand-engraved Balance Cock

As opposed to
Whip Regulator assembly

Awesome! I wonder if the class 30 was limited production.

Since I already had this little oldie half pulled apart, and looking at all the grunge cloggin its happy self, I had to clean it! Now it feels much better, and runs like a champ!

The black glass dial is NOT Elgin. Old for sure, 3 pin and probably US made. Neat white arabic numerals and all. Unfortunately it was damaged when some interim watch person tried to remove it. Lucky they stopped before too much damage was done. So I splashed a little Harley Black touchup enamel on it and it looks better. (Camera still hates trying to focus on it tho)

Now here comes the Shocker. The "new" Dial was installed by an experienced watch maker who drilled 2 new Dial post holes in the main plate and set one Dial post with a screw,

And set the other dial post with a TAPER PIN (da de da daa twilight zone time)! As the third post interfered with some wind and set stuff, this genius cut it off, knowing 2 posts would hold just fine. Also, notice how close these are to the original dial post screw holes of the watch. I still need to learn how to paint hands white tho.

Dave,
While I was looking for a part for you, I found a balance cock, with the regulator set-up exactly like the one in your post. Really different.
Brian C.

Hang on to that Rare puppy Brian!

Hope no one minds if I add to this old post.
I found this nice model 5 and had to see if it was any good.After cleaning it runs very well.
Data base says it's RR grade. I guess in 1894 it could be, even tho it is pendant set.
Serial number is 5071352

What do you think, was it worth my $20?

Great piece of work. Grade 108, you stole it!

NICE!

Thanks David and Dave. I bought it for the dial. The case back was stuck and covered with crud, and I thought all worn through to base metal. I was amazed when I started cleaning and found no wear.

Hey, David, did Elgin make any 17j 16s model 5's? I've never seen one.

Steve

Dave that is an amazing Elgin. I think I speak for a lot of us in saying we learn something new all the time. I can't believe the Elgin people went to the trouble and expense of doing it that way. WOW!

Nice! Great story, great watch.