In the 19th Century there were many watches accepted for Railroad use with less than 17-23 Jewels. In fact many 15 Jewel 18s Elgin watch grades are listed in the Yellow Ehrhardt book as marked "RR" for that very reason. The B W Raymonds made by Elgin with 15 Jewels WERE RR watches.

I have quire a few of these and every time I list one on eBay someone tells me that 15 Jewel watches were never used (or allowed) by Railroads.

The following is a clip about the time I am speaking of about Illinois Central Watch Specifications;

Waltham advertised 15 Jewel RR watches in that era

Dave,

You should just post those scans when listing a 15 jewel RR watch and I bet the critisms stop.

Steve

A lot of railroads had no standards at all for watch acceptance before the 1890s, when Webb C. Ball first made his proposals. What's more, (correct me if I'm wrong) I don't think that the process of manufacturing synthetic jewels was used until the 1890s, so a fifteen jewel watch was a very high grade of watch up until that time. The E. Howard company, which was one of America's most elite and presteigous companies, made fifteen and seventeen jewel watches as their highest grade. The Ball company at first contracted 18 size and seventeen jewel watches for their railroad grade watches from Illinois, Hamilton, etc. I think these early 18 size railroads are very fine watches, among the best for their time. They are very much under valued, in my opinion.

Here is my "No 35 Nickel" PENDANT SETTINGas advert. above, 1892 production date, Broke staff, Good mvt, eBay cost; $45.00! What do you think it is worth? (excepting anything about it in the Price Guide! )

Nice watch. I wonder how much it sold for when it was new.
Another comment: In Roy Ehrhardt's Elgin book, he considered some of the 15 jewel convertible models to be railroad grade. They were very high grade watches, fully adjusted, and highly finished.

I have an Elgin B W Raymond RR grade on eBay;
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISA...ageName=STRK:MESE:IT

A very Presentable watch and excellent example of this issue!

I thought this was a very interesting thread started up by Dave, and delved into it a little bit more using a booklet entitled, "American Pocket Watches", by George E. Townsend, 1977, and supplemented with new information in 1882 by R. Ehrhardt and W.F. Meggers.

I went through this publication and picked out the RR grade 15 jewel pocket watches these men identified. The surprisingly long list follows:


RR Grade Watches with 15 Jewels

Aurora Watch Co., marked “Aurora Watch Co., Aurora, Ill, Adjusted”
Grades 6, 8, 10, 11 and 12 - Models 2 and 3 (OF and HC)

Columbus, 18s, Models 2 and 3
RKW Special
Railroad King
Railway
Railroad Regulator

Elgin Grades: 58, 62, 69, 79, (18s, Model 1, KW)
H.H. Taylor Gr. 79
Elgin Nat’l Watch Co., Elgin, Ill, ‘adjusted’ (18s, Models 2-7)
Grades: 20, 33, 61, 76, 80, 143, 147
Elgin Nat’l Watch Co. Adjusted (16s, Models 1 and 2)
Grades: 50, 86, 49, 85,

Hampden - (below models are all 18s)
Railway Model 1 (KW), or Model 2 (HC)
J.C Perry Model 1 (KW) or Model 2 (HC)
Grade 36 - marked "Hampden Watch Co., Springfield Mass, or Canton, Ohio, Adjusted"
Railway Models 3 (OF) and 4 (HC)
Grades 56, 59, and 60 marked 'Adjusted'
Ball's Standard, Cleveland, O. model by Hampden

Illinois Bunn, Model 1 (KW/KS) and Model 2 (HC)
Illinois Miller, Model 1 and Model 2 (as above)
Illinois Stuart, Model 1 and Model 2 (as above)

Illinois marked “Illinois Watch Co., adjusted”, 18s
Grade 5 Models 1 and 2
Grade 64 Model 2
Grade 65 Model 2
Grade 103 Model 1 and Model 2
Grade 104 Model 2
Grade 105 Model 2
Grade 106 Model 2
Grade 107 Model 2

Illinois marked “Illinois Watch Co. adjusted” 18s
Grade 64 and 65
Model 4 (PS, OF)
Model 5 (LS, HC)
Model 6 (LS. OF)

Illinois, 18s, private labels
Railroad King Standard, Model 2 (Gr 5-s)
Wathier’s Railway, Model 2 (Gr 65-s)

Peoria Watch Co., “ Peoria Watch Co., Peoria, ILL.” 18s, marked
'Superior Quality' (nickel)
'Railway Service Anti-magnetic' (nickel or gilt)
'Antimagnetic' (nickel or gilt)
'Railway Service' (nickel or gilt)

Rockford - all 18s
Grades 2, 3, 12, and 13 (HC) marked 'adjusted'
Grades 43, 44, 45, and 47 - Models 3 (HC) and 4 (OF) marked 'adjusted'

Waltham Appleton&Tracy, Model 1857, 18s
Waltham PS Bartlett, Model 1857, 18s

Waltham Crescent St. Model 1870, 18s

Waltham Appleton & Tracy, Model 1883, 18s
Waltham PS Bartlett, Model 1883, 18s
Waltham Crescent St, Model 1883 18s

Waltham Gr. 25 and 35 (marked adjusted)

Waltham Appleton & Tracy Model 1877 and 1879
Waltham Model 1877 and 1879

Waltham private label (3): 1) Dominion Railway, 2) Express Train 3) Railroad King Special

Waltham Riverside Model 1888 16s

Am’n Watch Co. Waltham Mass.
Model 1860
Model 1862
Model 1868
Model 1872 – gilt

Appleton & Tracy & Co.
1860, gilt
1860, gilt, Stratton’s
1860, gilt, Vibrating
1862, gilt
1862, gilt, Stratton’s
1862 gilt, Vibrating
1868, gilt

Riverside, A.W.W. Co., Waltham, Mass
1872, nickel
1872, gold plated
1872, gilt