Just to let you know before hand. I will be parting out two consecutive numbers Sangamo Specials. These are being listed tonight on ebay & includes a 14k solid gold Sangamo Special case. This is not my doing, they were consigned to me & were shipped this way. This is the way the consigner wants it done. As you may well know, this is not my practice. Something I really don't condone. That being said, they are two very nice, complete marked sixty hour examples. I just wanted you to know I don't part out my own watches. Best, Jim

Jim,

I first interpreted to mean the set was being broken up, I didn't know it was the watches were being broken down all together. What a SHAME . I realize why you are doing it this way but what is the owner of these thinking. Someone going after the set just has to miss being the winner of one of the auctions and he is screwed. I just don't understand why anyone would want to do it that way, not to a consecutive numbered set anyway.

Steve

Link to just one of the 8 auctions.

I think these are the 2 consecutive numbered sets that have been auctioned before at a very high price. I understand the rare chance of owning two consecutive numbered high value watches but it was evident they would never sell at the price they were asking. It is indeed a shame that these have been torn down but I guess the owner can do as they wish. Just my opinion....
Ray

While I appreciate Jame's candor about, it is nonsense! Linking the "parts" to their associated auctions might have at least shown some respect for their "reassembly".

Sorry David,
These were shipped to me as parts in one box. I did not tear them apart. I have no idea what parts went with what watch. I'm pretty sure movement 809 went with the WGF pattern back case. 808 was once in a 14k white gold case with a presentation engraving as stated in the Sangamo Special case database. You can give me some flack, I'm a big boy I can take it, but I am just selling these on consignment. I sold them originally as complete watches. The owner of these decided that this is how he wants to sell them. Who am I to tell him what to do with his items or turn down this commission. If I did not sell them, some one else would have. I did try to talk him out of it, but his mind was made up. So, if you feel I am in the wrong some how, I'm sorry.

Jim is performing a service and has a fidujiary duty to do as the seller asks. Everyone is entitled to an opinion of the right or wrong of this, but to me it is irrelevant. If you are going to insert politics and personal feelings in biz dealings that can be a slippery slope. I am a member here and on 149 and I refuse to get into the politics or bad mouthing of individuals here or there. The same thing applies to business dealings, unless there was outright fraud or misrepresentation. If these were my watches I could understand seperating the pair, but certainly would not part them out. While I am a scrapper, I would certainly not scrap a gold Sangamo case, but there are many that I do scrap. In my eyes and of course just my opinion, I would do exactly as Jim is doing. The right or wrong of it, every one can decide for themselves. Geno

Please accept my apologies everybody. It is a sad moment indeed, I guess at least they did not melt the case.

I think many feel that the parts are worth more than the whole but in this case I have a tendency to doubt that. I guess selling them in the same auction with a reserve would seem to be the better way to go. I have a tendency to think the person overpaid for them at the peak of prices and now the prices have taken a tumble maybe he is hoping any method of recouping his money is ok. Sometimes when a message is bad you don't shoot the messenger (in this case) since Jim felt bad enough about it to apologize even though he was instructed to sell them that way by the owner.

No problem David. Thanks everyone for your understanding in this touchy matter.

Jim,

I hope you don't think I was in anyway putting you at blame for this matter. You are just doing what was asked of you. I also feel they should have been put up with a reserve first but todays values are certainly different form what the owner probably paid awhile back.

I myself would be a little cautious of going after these because if I got beat out on the second auction I would probably continue no further. After that, why bother to bid on the rest of the stuff. If the entire ebay community felt that way it will lack bidders other than the ones out for parts. We'll have to watch this one and see if the seller made the right choice.

Anyone know what these were purchased for the last time they sold?

Steve

With a total production of only about 2,200, this watch offers a better probability of finding a consecutive pair than a model with much higher production.

So if I have one of these Sangamo Specials, in theory I could consecutively pair it with only 2 out of the remaining population of 2198 watches (+1 & -1 S/N, assuming they all survive).

That's a slim probability, but its much higher than it would be if it was 2 watches out of 525,000 as it would be with a 992B.

Hi Everybody;

It IS sad to see the possibility that 2 consecutive serial #d SS 60 hr may not make it out in one piece. I'm saddened when I see all the Hamilton 992s and 992bs parting out. One one hand, you can't blame the seller. He'll probably realize more $$ from parts than the whole (driving UP the price of the survivors. I sell them whole for pretty good money, WAY more than parting them out) A 992 in a RR Model case in like new condition will fetch in the 600 range. It HAS to, to avoid the above massacre. And it does at my site. Now if I were the private seller on ebay who had no course other than to compete there, where good whole 992s in ANY case seldom fetch more than $300, he's gonna part the thing. He can get in the neighborhood of $400-$450 that way.

Like Lindell says, we'll just have to see how these SS play out. Personally, I don't think that they'll realize any more $$ doing it that way, but in this economy, who's got 10 grand to drop in the interest of keeping these two together...that's what they SHOULD fetch in a proper market. They won't come close to that in this one, tho. I personally own no less than a dozen UNMARKED sixtys, I have sold the marked ones, never kept one, personally I've always thought they were overvalued, but that's just me.
At any rate, will be interesting to watch. Happy holidays, everyone!

Hi Tom, Thanks for posting your astute observations.

There are plenty of 992bs around that are in sorry shape with some fair to good ones that could use the parts. While we all loath to see watches parted, we have to remember nothing lasts forever. Well, almost nothing.

It is difficult to understand the thinking behind parting two consecutive numbered sangamos for the few extra dollars this sale will generate. It remains to be seen if the sale indeed succeeds in that goal.

I hope Steve adds it all up.

So far its up to about $2200 for all the parts of both watches.

Final tally for all the parts was $11,037.84. Two different buyers got the movements. I tried for a set of hands but was the underbidder.

We must all need hands, I was second on the second pair...

Can someone explain to me why there would be an 800.00 difference in the final price for the two movements?. And, in your opinions were the prices realized for the parts more than what they would have sold for together?. Thank you, I have neither the expertise nor the money to know about such things .

Ray

Hello Group,
I think the consigner is very happy with the results. Last time I sold these they brought under $8000 for the pair. Over $3000 more, in a weak economy for parts? I hope the prices realized does not lead to more parting out of rare watches. But there is some good news concerning the movements. I am working on putting the two back together. My one high bidder is willing to sell the movement to the high bidder of the other or buy his. I think these two movements will end up together after all. All in all, it was fun to watch.

I will see what happens with the movements Lindell & pass it on. I will keep you posted. Best, Jim

It would be nice to see them back together but I also think we will see more & more of this, not because of your auction, just a sign of the time. The other day I was looking at a Ebay seller that usually parts out their watches, they use to do dial, case, movement & hands each separate. Now they take them down into to every single part & list each separate. I totaled it up for a Hamilton 940 that they tore down & it comes to about $500 in parts.

Tom

Just an update on the consecutive numbered Sangamo's that I just sold on eBay. As you may recall these complete watches were consigned to me in parts. The parts were sold to various buyers. Well, Don from Illinois was the high bidder on one movement & the dial with hairline. Lindell was the other high bidder on the gold filled case & good dial. Larry Jones from New Mexico was the high bidder on the 14k gold case. One bidder who does not want his name mentioned was the high bidder on the other movement. This one person wanted Don to know that he could have his movement if he wanted to keep them together for what he had paid. Don said yes.

Lindell, after hearing this, offered his dial & case for his bid price, if Don wanted them to keep together. Larry followed suit with the same offer on his case after what he heard was going on. Don said yes to all & said he was going to put the watches back together. So, they are all pack in the same box waiting to be shipped & reunited once again. A very happy ending to this most unusual set of circumstances. I would personally like to thank everyone that generously gave up their winnings for the good of the hobby. It is great when one does so, for the sake of the watch & not themselves. Thanks again everyone! Best, Jim

^

I'm presuming/hoping the hands were somehow included in the reunion.

This thread has been a facinating education for me. I had no idea that people would canabalize high end watches just to make a few more dollars.

I've always hated seeing those piles of parts that people advertise for steampunk jewelry and think it is just a crying shame that the parts seem to be worth more than the whole.

But I think this entire thread is a negative reflection on our throw-away society, as well as a positive reflection on the people of this forum who see real value in preserving these items that others see no real value in.

I am happy to be a part of a group of people whose vision is that of saving, rather than destroying objects of art.

All of you guys involved in this transaction should be very proud of the work you did to save these magnificent pieces.

I am very proud, if even just to know you through a computer screen.

Dale,

Parting out this consecutive pair is an extreme example of "anything for a buck" thinking, which could have resulted in a horological tragedy.

However a determined and unselfish team effort by IHC185 members, spearheaded by Lin Riddle, was able to derail a calamity in the making and achieve a decidedly happier outcome.

Well said Dale and Ed.

Ray