While digging through my "smile (fix me I am your watch and here waiting) drawer I sensed a choking sound coming from a nicotine-soaked "old" Illinois. I pulled it out and it started going tick TOCK kinda slow and looked me in the eye. I open the back and Eureka a GETTY with gold stuff all over the place!

So I look this up in a learned Illinois volume #2 that Sherry Lee sent me a while back, and it says by the S/N 1876897 this is a (cheap) Grade 185. I look around a little more and see references to this movement described as a (classy more valuable) Grade 187. So many "Bunn Specialists", belong to Chap 185, there must be a considerable and well-researched knowledge of all things "Illinois". So I ask you, is this a 185 (like our chapter), or a 187??? After I clean this today I will check back for a well studied reply.
OOOhhh . . . I pray for all of us to have a happy and safe Holiday time , and most of all PEACE IN THE NEW YEAR!!!!!!!!!!

hi david, where in so cal. do you live? feel free to call me as i cannot access your e-mail.

charlie winters
818-832-4555
los angeles area

You have a very respectable grade 185. It was adjusted to temperature, four positions and isochronism and is one of 6,390 made. A number of these had two-tone damasceening in various patterns. [info from Russ Snyder]

Charlie confirmed it's a 185. Lotsa glitter but a 185 by the markings. I will post some pics in a gfew of the cleaned piece.

Good point, as I doubt that in 1906 Illinois particfularly gave a hoot! It's CLEAN now beautiful dial on THIS 185, though . .

A clean movement with this much gold should be in Ft. Knox!

All "Buttoned up" running like a Champ!

Beautiful job, David. I can almost hear it ticking.

This was so soaked in Nicotine that I could still smell it when I opened the watch. This watch is running withing 4 sec a day as I write this reply. Maybe Nicotine has preservative powers we dont know about for watchworks.

quote:

Maybe Nicotine has preservative powers we dont know about for watchworks.

Maybe so. It's not good for much else.

A BEAUTIFUL watch. I love seeing these come back from the dead!

Regards! Mark

Some more rummaging in my gettys (I had a run on them for awhile) ans Lo and Behold, a 187 marked Ruby Jewels AND 187! I cleaned it and it runs perfect. While there is funny repairable dial chip The movement looks mint, Maybe it was put away early in it's lifetime.

As it was re-cased, maybe that explains the dial thing. But Charlie, thank you for explaining the why's and wherefores of the 185 187 dilemma, this is marked 187 and Also 17 Ruby Jewels, just like you said. Jerry, Philip and Mark Thank you and Happy New Year to you all.

David,
You have some beautiful watches there!

You did a fantastic job too.

Sheila, Thank you too, just for looking, and also I have expunged all the detritus of my aol. Thanks for that warning too! Oddly, my computer seems faster now . . . hmmmm

David,

Not ALL Grade 187 Illinois watches are marked "187" on the finger bridge -- there are some in the Private Label "Ariston" (made for Marshall Field & Co. of Chicago), but also some that simply don't have the "187" marking. Bill Meggers indicated roughly half of those he had seen were marked with the Grade number. Less common, Bill noted, was the presence of the company name on the watch movement -- only two of those shown in my Illinois database have the company name engraved on the pillar plate.

David,

Help me understand the distinction between the 185 and 187 that makes the 187 much more desireable/valuable.

Aesthetically, the 187 has the beautiful damasceening and the ruby jewels but your 185 has the beautiful 2 tone damasceening.

Mechanically, the 187 is adjusted to 5 positions as opposed to 4 for the 185. Is there any other differences in parts that make this more valuable or desireable.

You have some beautiful watches David thanks for sharing with us.

Mike

Thanks to Charlie Winters, I have learned that the 185 was a great movement, although not intended for RR certification. Illinois instead used the 185 for private labels and many named models. But compared to the 187, there were very few other differences, excepting the 187 was marked (and made with) "Ruby Jewels" and had 1 more position adjustment.

David,

Thanks for the information!