I was listening to a guy, that said he removes a movement from the case, along with the dial, and puts the movement in the cleaning machine, as is, to clean them.

I have NEVER heard of such a thing, was he joking, or just crazy? CRAZY!!!

Maybe we should start buying more watches so they won't get into the hands of people like this guy.

SAVE THE WATCHES!!!!!

Crazy ,,also you can,t get a watch clean like this nor could you lube the mainspring or cap jewels just to mention a few things..

Is this what is referred to as 'dip and ship'?

Well, this may not shed any light on the subject... but it was common practice to dip "Dollar-Watches" in Napthene to clean them. It was common practice because it worked, the watches started running again.

But back to reality. This dip and ship is happening and has been happening. Good watchmakers loose business from bad watchmakers because the bad watchmakers charge so much less. And then the watch stops a few days/weeks later and the bad watchmaker won't fix it or give a refund. The customer hears about a good watchmaker who charges more... decides to try him if the watch is worth enough. It goes round and round. The dip and ship guys have been around for quite awhile and they just keep moving. I think that's why reputation means so much in the watch repairing biz.

Frank "407" Kusumoto

Hi Sheila,

'Professional'????? watch repairers dealing in volume 'trade' repairs for jewellers in the UK, commonly use just this method.

The situation isn't helped any by companies which produce attachments for watch cleaning machines, and described as specific for this method of working, in effect they condone it!.

About 10 years ago, I bought all the workshop tooling from a guy that was retiring from the industry (ill health).
Amongst the tooling was a Brenray cleaning machine (almost new) which came with an attachment that would accommodate 6x watch movements in one hit - sort of spring clip devices all around the main shaft which replaced the usual parts baskets.

I asked him if it was ever used as I couldn't believe anyone would do work in this manner.

His response was that Jewellers sending out trade repair work wanted volume turnover, cheap and quick.
The only way he could make a living from such 'trade' work was to clean movements this way.

He did at least take off the dial and balance, but the rest just got dunked complete, not even the mainspring was removed - Ouch!.

The final rinse included a lubricant (PTFE or some such) so that he could just bung a watch back together ASAP.
They got demagnetised, and the balance a dunking in 'one -dip' and that was about it!

Those devices are still in watchmakers supply catalogues.
'Apollo Southerns' in the UK, list ELMA cleaning machines (similar to Brenray), and list such an attachment, which thay state can be used to clean movements 'stripped or complete'.

The blurb describes the attachment thus:

"The Counter Current principle - Modern Maximum cleaning effect for complete watch movements in the movements holder"!

I would never advise anyone here (UK) to take a watch to just any Jeweller to be serviced after discovering that trick!!

John

Wow, I had no idea this was happening, I thought he was just a bad repairer. He did say he removed the dial when he removed it from the case, but he may have been just doing it for himself.?
that's all I heard him say.
I'm glad I mentioned it here, it only goes to show that there are some bad guys out there, and that there are also some practices used, that I have to watch out for.
Good information! Thank you.

It's also good to know that only the Best have worked on mine. "The Only Way To GO"

I certainly would not recommend such a procedure, but I also do not think it is a crime. The procedure does the watch no harm as long as it is only run occasionally for a few minutes.

If the charge is appropriate for the labor and you only want the watch presentable, the procedure is very economical. If the watch has an intrinsic value of $50 it is difficult to justify a $175 full disassembly and cleaning.

Tom,
Good point! I didn't think of that.

So then, on ocasion, it could be a good thing?

Since I know nothing about these machines, I have to depend on those that know them, to keep me up on what is the truth about how to use them.

Almost everything tells me that there is something wrong with cleaning watches this way, but I'm sure not educated enough about cleaning watches to know for sure what is best.

I'm just glad that I get my watches done by the BEST. He can make a watch look like a real Gem.

I'll stick with him.....
(wait till he find out how many watches I have for him to fix)

I would not say good, only that it does no harm in an of itself. If the person having the work done believes the watch has been serviced for carrying, then it is wrong because subsequent damage could occur and the watch will not perform to its capabilities.

If you are having watches serviced as though they were going to be carried and then put them in one of Desmond's cases for 5 years, that is a bit odd also.

When having mid grade watches serviced for my collection that have a broken staff or whatever, I tell my watchmaker to "make it run." That means don't go to a lot of effort to restore the ink in the engraving or polish screws or whatever. If he also does not want to disassemble the cap jewels that is ok with me too.

Tom,
Now I see what you mean, thank you.

Information like this is so perfect for someone like me, that has been into collecting for a while but has no idea what is right when it comes to cleaning, and also gives me some insight into what I can do with some of my nicer watches that don't need too much work.

Now at least when a repairman tells me that my watch can use a little less work, like cap jewels, I will know that he's telling me something that's not crazy.

Good Information!
We who are new, have so much to learn.