February 19, 2011, 07:51
William VaughanDOUBLE SECOND HANDED ELGIN 21-22 JEWEL 16S
HI, I HAVE AN ELGIN 16S 21J WATCH IN AN ELGIN RR CASE. THE FUNNY THING IS THE SERIAL NUMBER CHECK SHOWED THAT SOME WERE 21 OR 22 JEWEL. THIS ONE HAS A SWEEP SECOND HAND AND A SUBDIAL. ON THE MOVEMENT IN A SMALL STAMPING IS US ARMY AC. I BELIEVE THE MOVEMENT WAS MODIFIED TO THE SWEEP SECOND HAND BECAUSE IT SAYS RIGHT ON THE MOVEMENT 21 JEWELS. THE 22nd I BELIEVE IS FOR THE SWEEP SECOND HAND.
THE PART FOR THE SWEEP SECOND HAND APPEARS TO HAVE BEEN MADE FROM ANOTHER PART WITH THE RIGHT JEWEL IN IT. ANYONE KNOW ANYTHING ELSE ABOUT THIS MOVEMENT. WAS IT MILITARY AND COVERTED? BILL VAUGHAN
February 19, 2011, 10:59
Claude GriffithThis Elgin watch is in the same mode as the Hamilton 992B/4992B, the 992B was the standard version and the 4992B was the military version with the optional "hackset" so that all watches could be set to the same exact time for a maneuver. Elgin also offered the same with the 21j 571 but the military version was a 581 that came in either a 21 or 22 jewel. If you go to the Elgin site and enter your serial number it should tell you which run was 21j and which run was 22j. If my memory is correct the extra jewel has to do with the hack set mechanism so it should be visible when you look at the extra gearing on the back of the movement.
February 21, 2011, 10:02
Jim HesterCould you please post clear photos of your watch, showing the movement, the dial, and the outside back of the case to show us all of the markings?
The 'US ARMY AC' stands for United States Army Air Corps, but your mention of it being in a Rail Road case sounds odd. It could very well be a marriage of parts which happens all the time.
By the way, please consider not using all capital letters when posting. On the internet the standard etiquette is that posting on forums with all capitals is considered to be shouting. Thanks.
February 21, 2011, 15:24
Jerry KingWilliam, your watch movement is an Elgin grade 581 and rest assured, it came that way from the factory....without knowing your serial number, I can't tell you exactly when....When posting questions regarding a watch movement always include the serial number of the movement....
Elgin made 20800 units of the grade 581 during 1940, 41 & 1942 in 9 runs....in all runs except part of #8 and all of #9 the 581's are shown to be 22 jewel, with mixed results in #8 and none shown in #9....
Regards,
Jerry
February 24, 2011, 13:19
William VaughanThanks for the info. I've already checked the Elgin site and it is just as Jerry King stated. I've attached a picture of the movement and the dial.
Bill Vaughan
February 24, 2011, 13:21
William VaughanHere is one of the dial that is on the Elgin SCT
February 24, 2011, 13:24
William VaughanNow I have to ask how did the hackset work? Bill