Hi All,
I found and bought a new watch today. It is a Hampden Wm McKinley model, 16s 21j. It is in an engraved Faheys Mantauk 20 year case which appears to be a reused case. The dial has no cracks, even under a 10x loupe, and the case has no brassing or significant wear. The lettering on the movement is completely gold infilled and the movement is bright, without any blemishes and appears to be running well and accurately. The Serial number is 2777263. I'm trying to learn to take photos of my watches and pens (my other collection) and at the same time, to post the photos. The damaskeening is very attractive so I hope the photos come through.

I would really appreciate any information or feedback anyone can give on this piece. I think I got it at a pretty good price and it really is an attractive watch. Thanks for looking,
Mark

Mark Blumer

[This message was edited by Mark Blumer on February 12, 2004 at 21:35.]

Here is the Dial. I could not get a decent photo of the case because of the glare. I'll try again later.

Mark

Mark Blumer

Hi Mark,

I'm a believer in Hampden Watch Co. products. This company along with Rockford, South-Bend and Columbus are little-known and under-rated. The watches from these companies represent true bargains in today's market.

Your "Wm. McKinley" was named for a US President from Ohio who was assasinated on September 6, 1901. He was the most popular president since Lincoln and was succeeded by Theodore Roosevelt. Hampdens were made in Canton, Ohio and McKinley is still warmly remembered in his home area. Schools, other public buildings and even the local Masonic Lodge revere his name to this day.

Here's some additional information...

Wm. McKinley Presidential Library and Museum

The watches that bear the "Wm. McKinley" name are solid and respectable as the man they were named for. The 21-Jewel 5 Position RR Grade example you added to your collection was produced in about 1912 and compares favorably with a Hamilton 992, Illinois Bunn Special, Elgin B.W. Raymond and the South-Bend Grade 227 in every respect.

The dial and hands are correct and it looks like you found a really nice example. Many expect Hampdens to be in a Dueber Case and they often were. The fact yours is not in the original case could mean the case wore out or someone wanted it for another watch.

Congratuations on a nice acquisition!

Lindell

Thanks Lindell!

Mark Blumer

...very nice watch!!!...Jim C

Great looking watch Mark thats a keeper! Ted

Though I publically state I'm an Elgin man, I've owned more Hampdens over the years than any other product, and have been happy with all of them. Even the low grade models are fine daily carry watches, and keep very good time. I currently own a 7 and 15 jewel model (have owned one 12s 21J in the past. I let it get away, though ), and keep picking them up. I did recently discover that there is yet ANOTHER family heirloom still in the family safety deposit box that I'm really wanting to take another look at, and that is an 18s Hampden 'Dueber Special' in an open face gold case. I have no other information about it, but apparently a great uncle (banker, by the way) carried it his entire life, so Hampden's and myfamily have a history as well. Carry it proudly! It's a VERY nice watch! High regards. Mark (the OTHER 'Mark' )

NAWCC Member 157508
NAWCC-IHC Member 163

I too own a inexpensive Hampden,a 11 jewel that keeps amazing time and weighs a tonne,I love the way it feels!

They are real nice under-rated pocket watches,and Lindell is right...they will go up in value..Something this well built will be appreciated eventually.

I too own a couple of Hampdens.The one I just finished cleaning and oiling is a, 16s, 17j "Mc Kinley".Sure wish I had one as nicely damaskeened as yours. She 's a real beauty.

Frank

Frank Juchniewicz

That is my name on Ebay. A few weeks ago McKinley Masonic Lodge in Canton, celebrated Pres. McKinley birthday (as they have for 102 years). Afterwards we had a dinner and a lodge meeting. I donated a Wm McKinley watch to the Master of the lodge to pass down to each following Master. And another I donated to a worthy brother for years of work on reenactment of McKinley funeral in Canton OH. We were to have over 10,000 masons in canton on Sept 15, 2001. Unfortunatly 9/11 got in the way and every thing was canceled. My friend who received the watch spent 2 days calling everone to report the cancellation. Lindell wanted me to take photos for #185, but I did not want to pat myself on the back in front of the brothers that deserved all the credit. Some times helping a fellow brother or sister only requires a pat on the back, some times money out of our pockets. Help promote Horology any way you can. mike

Since we are on the subject of Hampden's can anyone help with this watch, I was wondering if anyone had anything else, And Mike that would have been a Great Day for Freemasonry, Thank you for your help.

Jeffery Hann
NAWCC # 159734
Greentown lodge #341
32 degree A.A.S.R.
Valley of Indianapolis

Jeffery: I cann't read everything on your pix but I think what you have there is a Hampden watch that was a private label. Private label in that the damasking is just for that jewelry store and no other. Hampden did it for a store in Pittsburg Pa and I have one. On that one they do not list Canton, Oh on the movement. I left my book at the bakery and I cannot look up exactly who it was made for till tomorrow. Did you see the dial on the watch I am servicing for a friend. Its in the discussion on unnamed dials and if they are Swiss. mike

Believe President McKinley and John C. Dueber were close friends. Here's a factory photo with all the employees taken in 1913. The 5 ft.long picture was taken with a massive fish eye lense resulting in great curvature of the two buildings which were straight in line with each other. The employees were set up in large curve so the rows would appear straight for the photo. Unfortunately John Dueber is not in the picture having passed away six years earlier.

Ralph Rehner, "The Clock Pup" and Longines Watch Guy

Mike,the lettering on the watch is as follow's
21 jewels, double roller,adj. 3 pos,saftey pinion,Hampden, Canton,Ohio and the serial #2770945,and the dial says Hampden Watch co. hope this helps. Thank You

Jeffery

...a classic photo Ralph and likely one of the few that has survived!...a real treasure to be sure and one that visually catalogs a part of Ohio's renowned horological history...thanks...Jim

Jeff, this watch was made for the W.J. Johnson Company, Fourth Ave and Wood Street, Pittsburgh, PA. This model was called a 260 which I think only refers to the damasking. Its a standard model 4 Hampden like the Wm McKinley of its day. Also like the 105 it is railroad grade with lever set. It should fall into the same value range as these unless someone values the non traditionl damasking. Drop a line if you ever want to part with it or do some swapping. mike

Mike, this watch that I have is not a lever set, but a pendant set, so I am still a little confused, Thank;s

Jeffery

Jeffery,

I think you have a very interesting watch there, in some ways it represents something rather unique. Twenty-One Jewel adjusted to 3 rather than 5 positions is quite unusual to start with, and the finish has a "High-Grade" look to it. However a 3-Position in Pendant-Set is fairly common. I think Mike held the key in the fact the movement was specifically manufactured to W. J. Johnson's specifications.

Similar watches to yours came in both Pendant and Lever-Set. It's the "21-Jewels, 3-Positions, Pendant-Set" that makes your watch very different. A Highly-Jeweled, well finished watch adjusted to only 3-Positions makes for an unusual combination. That deviates from the norm.

Although I've never tried to make a list of them, each of the specially-made for W. J. Johnson watches I've seen strike me as a bit unusual. They are not "private-labeled" as such but clearly they are different, often like yours they are very different. What you have is yet another indication of how far watch companies would deviate from the norm to accommodate their customers. Today we have a difficult time understanding that.

There is not a watch exactly like yours shown in the authoritative Hampden Watch Company book put together by Bob Arnold and the late Jim Hernick. There are movements with numbers just below yours recorded as among those produced for W. J. Johnson but yours was not in the author's data-base. Nor was another just like it. Unfortunately like South-Bend the actual production records of the Hampden Watch Company are long lost.

There is much we can only speculate about today. One thing for sure you have an interesting and worthwhile example. Thanks for sharing it with us!

Lindell

Thank you all for the information, But I do have one question Lindell, if 21 jewel 3-pos. make for unusual combo's, then why don't they bring a few more dollars in the guide and not that it makes a difference to me, But I have posted another watch on this site under Illinois Captiol
any thought's would be great. Again Thank You all

Jeffery

Jeffery,

Alas in collecting the demand always affects the value most directly. Watches may be unusual but not necessarily desirable. The very unusual Supercharged 1958 Packard Sedans and Station Wagons were very low production automobiles, but they're not highly sought after.

By the same token your 21-Jewel 3-Position is quite unusual, but in a room full of Rail-Road Watch Collectors few would even bother to pick it up. Hampdens in general along with a few others as I mentioned above are not yet appreciated by mainstream collectors and therefore represent some real bargains in pocket-watch collecting.

Lindell

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