To All: In my small European Collection. Verge Fusee/Button Type. What is a Button Fusee and what makes it different from other Verge Fusse's. Watch is 1750/1780's with Jas. Smith/#8405. Button Type. They Say-?????.Info. anyone, Thanks, Sam.

Sam,

If you have a camera, an image of the watch would be a good place to start.

William

Hello William: Thanks, we will post pictures tomorrow. Sam

Hello again William: We were able to provide the images tonight. I have never opened the dust cover but recently at a show a watchmaker showed me the movement. He showed the verge movement and the Egyptian etching which was beautiful. The watch runs but as he said does not keep great time but never did. Thanks for your information as to the so-called Button Fusee.

First photo is front in outer case. Sam

Outer Case, Back. Sam

Dial without Bulls-eye Crystal. Sam

Inside Outer Case, Bezel & Crystal opened. Sam

Back of Watch with Key Wind Hole. Sam

Inside Inner Case with Hallmarks. Sam

Dust Cover with Jas. Smith - #8405, Sam

Inside of Outer Case. Sam

Hi Sam,

I have never heard the term "button fusee" and was hoping that a picture of the watch might provide a clue but the watch appears to be a very common pair cased verge fusee of which many, many were made. Although considered common, traditional English watchmaking was practiced at a very high standard and most of these are beautifully made and decorated.

I'm probably just telling you stuff you already know so maybe someone else could chime in.

William

Hi William: Thanks for your response. You are correct that the watch does not qualify as a high-end Verge Fusee. The early dates more than likely make it more and more a possible collectors keep. Thank you again for your input. The Button Fusee will remain a mystery to me. Sam

Hello All: To Gerald and others with interest. Would appreciate any info as to collector interest. Really old!!!! Thanks, Sam. Also pro and con comments will be helpful.

Sam

Commenting on a watch without seeing the movement could make a total fool out of me - so take this with (tiny) grain of salt.

There is something I call 'the wall' of pocket watch collecting: an imaginary frontier in time when things become rare and collectibles by their pure existence. For european watches it is the year 1800 and you could compare this with the civil war era for american watches.

The watch is british and it dates earlier than 1800.

The maker is named Jas (James) Smith of London. There are at least 10 london watch and clockmakers listed with that name which could lead to some confusion dating this watch.

The case is made from gilt brass or pewter and has only a makers mark and no date information as it would be on a case made of precious metal.

With the style of the case, the hands (beetle and poker) and the dial I would date this watch 1770 - 1790. If I compare the watch with other Smith watches and take the serial number as useful information the watch was made close to 1780. (I found one watch with identical dial, #7706 dating to 1774)

Looking to Brittens 'Old clocks and watches and their makers' I found one Smith Jas: White Horse Court, Bishopsgate, 1776-1790; all sorts of clocks and watches made, mended and sold by James Smith.
It is possible that pictures of the movement could verify the information.

Regards
Gerald

Gerald, as usual this information is more than I had and my wife will help with pictures of movement. Could you spread some light why one collector called the watch/button type. Could this be that the case utilizes buttons to open?

Regards, Sam

Sam
I've never heard a watch named button type.
It could be a simplification of verge fusee pair-cased with push-button outer case.
Or it is a mis-translation of the french oignon (onion) for early fusee watches with high pillars.

Gerald

Hi Gerald: When you get the photos you will observe that the watch does not have a round shape but is smaller and even has an onion shape or egg shape. This the best explanation I have had. Could this watch be older and can't wait to get the pictures. I will close this post because is becoming a burden to handle. Will start a new post. Regards, Sam.

If you use the page down key on your keybord you could easily handle longer posts.
I would prefer to keep all information about one watch in one thread to make it better usable for others.

Regards
Gerald

Thanks Gerald, Will Do.