Can anyone tell me anything about this watch. It was my Grandfathers. He lived in Hungry but where he got this from or when in not known. Pre ww2 is about the best I can do. Case is 14k solid gold but dust cover is base metal. I can not find any information of FLORE or FLOR so assume it is a trade name. Perhaps someone recognises the movement.
TIA Steve

The movement. There are a few hallmarks inside the back lid but so far have been unable to get a usable picture. I will add one if I can figure it out. Don't be shy if you think it is junk. I just want to find out what it is and since it will never be sold it's value or lack of does not matter.

Stephen,

I know everyone thinks I have Gruen on the brain, but your movement struck a familiar chord with me as soon as I saw it. It's not an exact match, there are a couple of plate screw differences, the channel next to the balance cock differs, the ratchet assembly doesn't match, but the bridges, the regulator, the train layout, and even the damascening are awfully close.

This Gruen movement is a late 1920s, 15 jewel, non-Precision grade model. Likely that it was made by one of the "Guild" contractors. This basic movement was in production with slight variation for about 20 years, ranging from 15 to 21 jewels. I don't know which one of the several makers who produced these early movements for Gruen might have made this movement. This may be just a coincidentally similar to yours, but it might also be a start at finding out the maker.

Regardless, yours is a good quality Swiss 17 jewel (it appears) movement with a swan-neck regulator. Strictly middle grade, but good quality nonetheless.

Regards,

Cary

You may want to check out the link below, it's about the Longines Watch Company and a watch called the Flore Marine watch however, it's in the 1970's I think, but you may also want to write to Longines and ask them.

The link is only information about Longines and is not connected to them, it's more like a sales site, but it does have a watch with your watch name in it, so more research about the Longines watch may be in order.


Here are two paragraphs of some of what it says.
See link below.

Longines has an extensive collection of time pieces for men and women. In fact the collection is so extensive that not all models are shown on their official web site. The collections include but are not limited to the Dolce Vita, the LongoMare, the Lindbergh and the Heritage. Some of their better known pieces are the Lindbergh air navigation watch; the Flore Marine of the 1970?s the Feuille d'Or which became the slimmest watch in the world in 1979.


Like many other manufacturers Longines was taken aback by the advent of the "http://watchesinfo.net/Longines.php" \l "" in the 1970?s. The company rebounded however with the creation of time pieces such as the Flore Marine, the Vagues and the Kleopatra all of which won the coveted Golden Rose of Baden-Baden award.


http://watchesinfo.net/Longines.php


Hope this leads to some more information about your watch. Maybe..............

Hello Sheila and Gary. Thanks to both of you for the information. I have mentioned both ideas to my father this morning when he rang me and got the following additional information. Dad is certain that Grandpa did not have the watch when he left Hungry in 1948. He also recalls that Grandpa was friendly with a professional family who ran an architect business. This family fell on hard times when the Russians took over. Several years later the husband died and it is possable that this watch and some other bits of jewellery also in the family were purchased from this source. Grandpa was not a wealthy man. He worked for the gas company and often did odd jobs after work. When the city converted from coal gas to natural gas just after the war the gas company did not provide any help to users what to do. Grandpa got a lot of work on the side helping people to get their appliances working again.
He would often refuse payment instead doing the work in exchange for something he needed. Perhaps he got it this way but it seems a rather large fee for the work involved. It is unlikely that he could have afforded to buy a new gold watch at any time and we believe this watch would have been second hand when he got it.
Grandpa passed away in the mid 80's. All this considered I think it likely that the watch dates to before ww2 rather than after. Having said all that the watch is very thin. I did check the Longines site but alas they did not have any pictures of a Flore Marine. I did get the impression they may have been talking about a wrist watch. Have added a side view with an inch ruler beside for comparison. Nice pattern on the case as well.
It is all interesting stuff.
Steve

After a lot of experiments I have managed to get a reasonable picture of the hallmarks. Likely the case and the movement were not made by the same company but perhaps one of these marks will point to a date or place.

Stephen,

The case marks are typical Swiss hallmarks for a gold watch intended for export. The hammer, squirrel, 14k/56/.585 are all marks showing gold content. I can't make out the mark to the right, nor the digits inside the hammer head, both of which might narrow things down.

These marks were standardized sometime after 1881, and the hammer became standard in 1934 (although it was used earlier, and I believe your watch predates that). The sheaf of wheat, which is an old Australian hallmark for 9K gold, is, I believe, in this case a maker's mark. Which maker, I don't know.

For what it's worth,

Cary

I'm pretty new at this but could that be a German Hallmark worn down a little? I think that was a circle with a crown in the middle.

Rick

Hello Cary,
The numbers inside the hammer head are 102.
The symbol on the right looks like the squirrel on the left but smaller and narrower. There is a letter under it but still inside the boundry of the mark. Could be a small letter "c" or perhaps "o" Alas my camera does not have enough pixles to get a shot of these small features.
Steve.

Stephen,

The "102" is a casemaker's ID number, but I don't know of a reference to tell which one. There was a list in the 12/2005 Bulletin, but it showed only current makers. Probably not much help anyway, as these references are for the maker of the case only, not necessarily the whole watch. This does date it to 1934 or later, but I would think it was early in that range, just based on the dial styling. If the squirrel on the right is sitting above a "C", that likely means the case was made in la Chaux-de-Fonds. A capital "G" would be Geneva.

Rick, It could be a crown, but I believe that the stamp is a sheaf of wheat, or perhaps a basket of flowers. I also think that it's a case makers mark, largely due ti it's placement well above the other stamps. The German silver mark is a crown with a crescent moon. I'm not aware of a similar mark for gold. Of course I could be wrong.

Stephen, my best guess is that this is a "private label" watch, not unlike those made for jewelers and RR inspectors in the US. There are many examples of unsigned (or unknown signatures) in Swiss watches from the early 20th century. If you consider the turmoil in Europe during the 1900 to 1950 period, it's not surprising to think that any reference to a jeweler may have disappeared. I think that "Flore" is likely a retailer, who had a few private label watches made, rather than any sort of manufacturer.

It's still a neat watch, and with the family history, should be a treasured prize for you.

Regards,

Cary