Just purchased this one, as I wanted to have one and this one looked quite good, I believe it is a far later model, as the dial is perfect, keeps relatively good time, and the case was quite unique. I was wondering tho what the Hebdomas, then the Vollaire under the dial means, I was led to believe they were made by different manufacturers ??? I have seen Hebdomas Arnex, and I think a couple of others, maybe this is just a swiss fake of a inexpensive swiss watch ? Interesting.
Any info, good or bad is helpful.
Thanks,
Bill

mvmt

case1

case rear

another

Bill, looks like a real Hebdomas. I have seen some cased in nicer cases and others with lessor made cases. Mainsprings are hard to locate for these watches,they are very long. Enjoy.

Hi Bill
In my eyes this is a somewhat unusual Hebdomas. I`ve never seen any in a hunter case before. Congrats to a very nice find.
Krister

Bill, a Very nice Full Hunter Hebdomas Type watch, and not too many of them around and in such nice condition.

Take a look at the topic here, as there's a lot more info and example of their type:

https://ihc185.infopop.cc/eve/f...1010082/m/1761048813

I have doubts your watch is a 'genuine' 'Hebdomas' even though it has the word fired into the enamel dial, as the dials and mainspring barrel on 'Patented' Heb's are (in my experience) invariably inscribed ' 'Hebdomas Patent'

Although yours has Hebdomas on the dial, there's no patent mentioned, or any indication of such on the barrel, so most likely by one of many makers (Vollaire?) that cashed in on the type during the height of their popularity.

It's still a beauty, and no less valuable, as Good condition patented and non patented Heb's are becoming pretty much even Stevens on value these days.

Additionally, all parts on Genuine Heb's are interchangeable, a claim made by Hebdomas, with the text actually cast into the mainspring barrel face.

The exception to the rule are Roskopf (pin pallet) types, which are Hebdomas variants, but only in as much they have visible escapements and purportedly run for 8 days.
Nothing on those types are interchangeable with the Swiss levers, except maybe the dials, but as most Roskopf dials were made like crap and non patent, it's a moot point why anyone would bother.

Nice catch, enjoy it.

John

Krister, Ernest, and John.
Thanks for all the info and comments on this watch. Sorry it so long to get back, but seeing as I am travelling, I don't have internet half the time.
John have you ever seen a watch as this marked Hebdomas, without being one ? I would have thought seeing as Hebdomas is still in production they would not be willing to share the name with another maker. I realize that there are other imitations etc, but not with the name on them ???
Either way it is quite a decent looking watch, and now that I have had a real chance to have it in hand, I notice that it seems to slip sometimers when winding, but reading a past post it seems that that is not to unusual, do not quite understand why, and think it might be hard to get a full wind out of it, but can't have it all I quess. They really are neat looking watches..
Thanks again,
Bill

Bill
Not that I know for sure, but it seems to be a feature that is built in to avoid over winding. Both my Hebdomas slip when they are fully wound.
Krister

My turn for apologies this time Bill, been a busy week.

'have you ever seen a watch as this marked Hebdomas, without being one'

Only one that's not marked 'Hebdomas Patent' Bill.
I'm no expert on Patent law, and I'm not even going there, but I'd guess more than a few makers and chancers cashed in on the unique design hoping to get away with it, just as others did for other watches that were unusual enough to warrant being copied.

Did Hebdomas have the patent on the word 'Hebdomas' itself? ..... on a watch probably, just like Richemont have rights on the word 'Tank' on their watches, which will get you a knuckle rapping if caught using it to describe a watch case on something that's Not a genuine Cartier watch!
But then I'd guess Richemont have a lot more legal muscle now than Hebdomas would have had back then.

You could take the dial off and check the dial plate, all genuine Hebdomas patent watches I've had through my hands have had their trademark stamped there.
If there's no trademark, I'd say it wasn't the real deal, but yours is such a nice watch, I wouldn't fret about it if there's none.
I've posted a pic of a typical Hebdomas trademark on the dial and dial plate.

Re the mainspring, as Krister says, they're designed to slip when fully wound.
The mainspring barrel has a length of spring locked into the wall by a curve in the end of the spring, rather than a hook.
The end of this spring has at its other end, a hook proper onto which the mainspring is attached.
As the spring becomes fully wound, the cupped end slips out of its location until it goes full circle, and drops back in again as the watch is wound.
You'll keep hearing a gentle click as it slips over and back in again.

Another big issue with these watches, is winding stem wear - or rather wear to the hole in the plates, which gets extreme enough to cause the winding wheel to move away from the barrel under pressure during winding, and slip over the back of the barrel teeth.

The damage done if not attended to, will cause the barrel to need replacing as the teeth become stripped off.
This damage also sounds and feels similar to the mainspring slipping over, so you need to check that the stem isn't actually slipping on the barrel teeth!

The plus is, whatever gets damaged can easily be replaced, because parts and donor movements always crop up on eBay, but they're getting expensive even for crap!

John

Hebdomas Patent dial script.
Dial is a mess on this watch, so just posting the decent bit.

John

Bill
I just took a closer look at the signature on the dial, and I think it says Voltaire instead of Vollaire. That could be a reference to the famous French writer.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voltaire
Just a thought.
Krister

Hi Bill,I'm getting in on this a little late,but I read an article somewhere that said Arnex purchased their movements from Hebdomas.I have one that the dial is signed Hebdomas and Arnex.I pulled the dial and has a Hebdomas logo tamped in it with several small stars and the number 101.Not the sane as Johns,but definetly Hebdomas.Regards,Norm

Krister,
I believe the letters on the dial are 'vollaire' and it is from the verb, 'to fly' meaning the watch runs well, or it really flies - that sort of thing.

Mike

PS Bill, was this the watch the Agayev's had up for sale on ebay not too long ago?

Norm, Krister, and Mike,
Krister, it does say Vollaire, just one of the "L's" is in different script.
Norm, As of yet i am not going to pull the dial, as I definitely am not the taker apart type of guy, taking apart might not be hard, putting together, possibly somewhat different. I will get it serviced at some later date and will know for sure.
Mike, no I actually got this at a pawn shop in Sidney, Nova Scotia when I was on holidays this year.
Thanks for all the input from everyone.
Bill

Bill
Thank you for clarifying. Then it could be what Mike suggested. (But admit that my suggestion was exciting ).
Regards
Krister

Hi Krister,
Yes you're take would have been worth looking into, and as always I am open to all info on watches,
Thanks again,
Bill

Don't want to hijack the thread, but I just listed a Hebdomas on the IHC185 auction site if anyone is interested.