Evidence suggests that this is the first production stem wind by E. Howard & Co.

More interesting, the dedication is interesting.

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I've never, EVER seen one with a dedication to someone connected to the Erie Canal! Amazing!

Regard! Mark

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Old Hiram had a nice watch & a nice house;
http://www.perintonhistoricals...on/wilbur-house.html

And it is for sale for $600,000

Desmond. That's a real beauty, but what leads you to believe it is the first stem-wind watch produced by Edward Howard? Wouldn't he make a higher-grade "first" than that one? I'm also surprised by the Canadian dial. Wouldn't such a dedicatee be an American working in New York?

kh

Keith? You see this one?

To those who misread my post, the house was listed for sale on the web, I do not own the watch, it is apparently Desmond's. So I am not selling it.

That said, though, I'm sure if Desmond was offered $600,000 for this watch, he'd be sorely tempted to sell it.

Regard! Mark

$600K would, in all likelihood, get my attention

Yes, Mike. I see it, and I'm exercising great restraint.

Col George Townsend asserted that the series IV was the first production stem wind. I should have stated the lowest serial thus found for the [series IV]. I very, and incorrectly, said 'first' when I should have said 'lowest serial number thus found'. The lowest George had found was 30,072. I found movement 30,038 but sold it to a friend in Seattle when I found 30.017. I regret have not been more explicit. Sorry about that.

I am not a Howard expert, so a few things puzzle me.

First, "Series IV" Howards are also, I believe, known as "Model 1871," at least implying that that's when they were first produced. Is this correct?

Second, if correct, does any think it odd that Desmond's watch has an 1873 inscription? I am not sure what to think about that because I own Series IV #30,556, about 540 numbers higher than Desmond's watch, and it has an 1894 inscription. (Perhaps coincidentally, my watch, like Desmond's, is in an 18k Wheeler Parson hunter case.)

Third, someone questioned why Desmond's watch has a "Canadian" dial. I don't see anything that suggests "Canada" to me. What's "Canadian" about the dial?

Howard simply stored movements of a grade in drawers and when a watch was sold, a hand went in and retrieved a movement without reference to serial number. Waltham was similarly known to store higher grade movements in a like manner. A knowledgable Howard/Waltham researcher explained this phenomena to me some years ago. Also, this watch was purchased within the collector community - not from a virgin source so anything could have happened. In other words, it was not acquired from the great grandfather of the vendor. It might be wise to consider the movement and the inscription

Ethan, I would prefer to let a Canadian explain to you how or why those particular dial got their name. But you'll notice, if you look around, that most E. Howard dials are not like that one, with Arabic-numerals above Roman.

kh

Thanks for the explanation on the sale of movements this makes more sense..

Ken, I only have three non-Keystone Howards. Two of the three have Arabic numbers for minutes above the Roman numbers for hours. (See the photo below of the dial on my "L".) My small sample may not be representative, but it suggests that Howard dials often display that form of double numbering.

Ken, I don't think this style of numbering being "Canadian," I think you are confusing an Arabic minute track with an Arabic hours track showing hours 13-24.

Here is an example of the kind of dial I have heard folks describe as "Canadian." It is on an Elgin 214 I used to own.

...which is now in my collection via Chris Abell.

Regard! Mark

Mark, I am glad you have that lovely watch. I sold it when I disposed of the relatively few "railroad" watches I had in my collection. My collection principally focuses on high end, elegant watches.

Me too, Ethan. It's a beauty, and keeps perfect time.

Regard! Mark

Ethan, I'm not confused. Most E. Howard VII and VIII series, for example, have just Roman numerical dials. Canadian authorities, as I understand it, had a preference for the other, so to satisfy both U.S. and Canadian markets, Howard and others created the "Canadian" dial with both -- small Arabic numerals above Roman. (Jeez. Where's Lorne when I need him?)
The first dial above has nothing to with that, but you might want to peel off the dial and check for a signature. It might very have one. Hallmarks everywhere.

What I meant to add before letting that last note go, is that there is a pretty good chance that the back of that radial-dial is signed J. Moorhouse.

kh

Ken, I probably should have mentioned that the dial on my Howard L-size, shown earlier in this thread, is signed by Moorhouse on the back.

As for Arabic minute tracks, my N-size Series VII does not have one, consistent with your statement that they usually don't have them. My other two Howards have Arabic minute tracks. One is the L-size shown above. I don't know what series it is; its movement looks very similar to an N-size Series VII. The other is my G-size, which I think is Series VI.

Would someone tell me whether the bold hour markers are Arabic or Roman. Inquiring minds want to know...

Hi.
I don't know what that font is called, but I think it says M. I. (or possibly F) Studebaker.

Regards Krister.

Desmond, I think those are Romanabic numerals

I'd say W. F. Studebaker.