Gold or Gold Filled?

April 20, 2008, 03:45

Dick Gilbert

I recently bought an 18s Waltham in what I thought was just a well engraved, 25 yr, gold-filled case. The inside of the back is stamped with the case number and Jas. Boss scales with crown above but with no additional reference. The dust cover is also stamped with the case number and with the 'C'/'O' mark in a cuvette normally associated with Keystone cases. There are no other marks and, as far as I was concerned, this was just a rather nice gold filled case.

However, I've just removed the movement for cleaning and noticed that, on the inside of the band, it's clearly stamped "JAS. BOSS 14K".

From the scales and crown (and lack of flex in the back and dust cover) I still think it's a '25 yr' or 'Extra' case but I didn't think Jas. Boss went in for this type of blurred description. Has anyone else seen similar markings?

April 20, 2008, 04:48

Frank Kusumoto

Really? Pictures please. I was always under the impression the crown meant "gold filled". Is there somewhere further down the band that it's saying "gf"?

April 20, 2008, 05:25

Sheila Gilbert

Dick,
According to my 1915 "Trademarks of the Jewelry and Kindred Trades" book, on page 184, Keystone did make a case with the mark. Jas. Boss with the scale and crown that's listed as 14k gold filled 25 yr. Sorry I can't post a picture of it, I don't have my scanner up and running.
Sheila

April 29, 2008, 07:20

Dick Gilbert

Thanks Folks,

I'll try to get a picture up at the weekend.

April 29, 2008, 10:08

C. Keith Johnson

Hi Dick, This subject has been covered well on the 185 Board. Run a search on "J Boss" You will get over 50 hits,scroll down to Gold Case and you will learn all about the 14K Dust Band........Keith

April 29, 2008, 15:11

Lindell V. Riddle

Dick,

Sheila is correct, whenever you see the crown above scales on a J. Boss case that indicated a 25-Year case, the same scales without the crown was a 20-Year indicator. This specific marking is covered on page 38 of the "Complete Guide to Watches" which is available to all our IHC185 Members at "Join and Support the Internet Horology Club 185" for only $27.95 including shipping to any address in the world.

It is important to recognize the "Jas. Boss" patent was granted to James Boss when he perfected the gold-filled process for watch cases. At the time these were originally made and marketed everyone involved in the jewelry trade would have recognized that fact. So the name "Jas. Boss" followed by "14K" would be like expressing "14K Gold-Filled" and would not have been confusing at that time. The James Boss patents were acquired by the Keystone Watch Case Company where they became famous as "Keystone J. Boss" cases.

For those new to this hobby, do not be confused by these markings. Generally speaking "Jas. Boss" or "J. Boss" on a case or on a spacer ring in such a case for that matter means it is NOT solid-gold. The brand name is synonymous with "gold-filled" on watch cases. Such items will always prove to be "gold-filled" which means a layer of gold over brass. Whenever we speak of "gold case" we mean a "solid-gold" case.

More about the spacer rings, those were designed to allow the same case to take a variety of watches by different manufacturers, this was before the movements were standardized. Not all cases would easily interchange from one movement to another. When you hear the term "fitting" making such modifications as this were part of fitting a particular movement into the case chosen by the original purchaser.

In the image you see below the spacer ring is inserted into the case. On this one someone has made a deep scratch to test it for gold content, the scratch turned brown due to the brass underneath a layer of gold.

Keystone Watch Case with a "Jas. Boss" spacer ring...

April 30, 2008, 19:21

Robert Schussel

Lindell
I suspect that Jas Boss 14kt was always meant to decieve.Special sleeves were sometimes put in the cases that a jeweler could remove that said J Boss 14kt ( like your picture) to make the buyer think they were getting a solid gold case.

Bob

May 31, 2008, 20:47

Dick Gilbert

Thanks to everyone who helped on this. I was pretty sure that (from the scales) it was gold-filled but needed confirmation.

Thanks again,

Dick