South Bend Question

November 06, 2004, 11:29

Joseph T. Collins

South Bend Question

I recently aquired my first PW. It is a South Bend Grade 227, Ser. # 1019407 in a B&B Royal 20 year case, ser. # 6555946. While setting the time I noticed that there are two slots for the set lever. I aquired the watch from a neighbor of 20 years who has owned it since he found it in 1939. He was 7 years old at the time. I know that it has not been recased in 65 years. My question is: What would explain the extra slot?

Thanks for any help,
Joe

November 06, 2004, 12:38

Edward L. Parsons, Jr.

Joe,

Whenever your movement was put into this case, it appears the lever cut that was original to the case didn't line up right, so the jeweler had to cut another slot in the right spot for the set lever on your movement. To me that would seem the most likely explanation.

November 06, 2004, 15:10

Lindell V. Riddle

Joe,

Ed is probably right, but perhaps additional information might be of interest...

Lever-Set 16-size South-Bend movements have the lever at 8 minutes past the hour, whereas most other makes positioned their lever at the 6 minutes position. For that reason a South-Bend Lever-Set movement placed in a case that previously held another make will often have of necessity a second slot like yours has, or a wide slot which would span the distance. A wide-cut slot allows the user to pull out the lever more easily and without snagging the thumb nail.

Another explanation of the two lever-cuts involves the original purchaser choosing a case that had been previously cut whether by the jeweler or even the case maker at the 6 minutes position. This could be from simply choosing such a "pre-cut" case or one that was on display with another make of movement in it. Interestingly, Waltham and Illinois case screws are positioned closely to that of your South-Bend so it can be somewhat difficult to be certain if the case previously held another make.

By the way, your South-Bend Grade 227 is a good RR Grade watch of which about 45,000 were produced. It's fully comparable then and now to a Hamilton 992 or an Illinois 21-Jewel Bunn Special. The serial number 1019407 dates to the mid 1920s by most estimates and at that time the South-Bend 227 was the lowest priced fully approved Railroad Watch on the market. The 227 is a Model 2 and shares much of its design with everything from a lowly 7-Jewel 203 up to 21-Jewel Grade 229 "The Studebaker" movements.

For additional South-Bend information check this link...

https://ihc185.infopop.cc/eve/forums?a=tpc&s=3206049661&f=7186009181&m=398107005

Lindell

November 06, 2004, 17:05

Joseph T. Collins

Ed and Lindell,
Thanks for the replies to my query.
Lindell, I had read your "History of South Bend" before I bought this watch. I gave my neighbor what I considered a fair price after looking at what they were going for on Ebay.
I have examined it thoroughly, in good light, and can find no basemetal showing. That 20 year case sure is tough! It does, however, have a couple of fine hair lines on the dial.

Thanks again,
Joe

November 06, 2004, 17:55

___________

Congrats on the purchase Joseph! A South Bend 227 is a nice first watch and I am sure you will enjoy it.

Fred

November 06, 2004, 18:06

Terry Hill

One thing to consider here also is ...

you state the owner obtained in 1939......

that would be plently of time for the watch if used in service to wear out an 'original' case..

folks scrimpted and saved then.... they had to... so the original owner could have had recased in a different case before you neighbor ever saw it.......

Enjoy the watch, keep it serviced and wear it.... it will last many many more years!

November 06, 2004, 19:28

Joseph T. Collins

Terry,
Perhaps I did not make it clear. The neighbor found the watch and a ring when he was a 7 year old boy. They were in a bag lying in the gutter of a St. Louis street. The watch has had very little use. When he found it he was too young to carry a watch and by the time he was old enough to carry one he opted for a wrist watch.
The watch was in this case when he found it 65 years ago.

Joe

November 06, 2004, 19:46

___________

Joseph -

I believe Terry meant that in the years between the movement's manufacture and your neighbor's 1939 find the watch could have picked up a replacement case.

Fred

November 06, 2004, 20:06

Tom Huber

The lever cuts for that case are not that uncommon. Aside from the South Bend, Hampden and Illinois model 5 movements also lever set at the 8 minute mark. I have seen a number of factory cut cases with the two slots. I believe that most are Deuber cases. These were made to accept the Hampden movements, but were also ready to accept other makes if the customer desired. My guess is that the case is original to that watch.

Tom