Hello Group,
1st, I would like to wish everyone a Happy Thanksgiving!
Now, I have a question for everyone & would like their opinion. I have a choice to purchase either a 20s Waltham Mod. 1862 15 jewel, KW KS Appleton Tracy in a coin silver case. Or a 18s Waltham 23 jewel Vanguard open face wind indicator. Both scarce and valuable. Both in excellent condition. Both from the same collector. I can only purchase one & both are the same money to me. Which one is more valuable? Thanks for your input. Jim

Photos of the AT 1862. Which watch is this one in the book?

James,
Your 20s watch does not have a vibrating hairspring, and it does not have the Maltese cross, so those factors should narrow your search down in the big, fat book as to which one you have.
The serial number suggests this watch is a 1-star, 15-17J model. If it were me, for the same money, I'd go for the 18s, Vanguard 23j, W.I. ALTHOUGH, you did not suggest in what condition the Vanguard might be, so I might have to rethink the those values. I bet that Vanguard is a beauty! Thanks for posting pics of the 20s - I never saw one before.

I am not familiar with these but Mike don't they mean that the maltese cross is the part of the stopwork on the mainspring barrel, that wouldn't be visible unless you took the watch apart. Like I said I have never seen on either but that is what I thought was meant by the cross.

Below is from the Waltham Ledger for that serial number

Thanks Mike for helping me narrow down my options on which 20s this was. Not having a vibrating hairspring or the Maltese cross makes a big difference. I will have to agree with you, it looks like it will be the Vanguard. And you are right, the Vanguard is a beauty. It's a shame though, I have never owned a 20s. Maybe I'll be able to get it from him another time.

If it helps, here are more photos of the movement.

For the same money, not even close get the up/dn Geno

.... and here is a picture of a vibrating hairspring and what I thought was a maltese cross on your watch, James.

Wow Mike very nice, top of the line American grade vibrator a true super star. Geno

Geno,
'Google images' is a wonderful thing.

Mike

Thanks for correcting me, as I said I had never seen one & the cross is what I thought it was but I didn't realize it was built into the plate like that. I appreciate you finding that, as usual I learned something today!

I would love to own that watch.

Tom

What's a vibrating hairspring?

I take it that it's got something to do with the extra jewel on the balance cock?

I think this is the patent for it, except you will notice that in the actual movement the coil spring that is attached to the end of the rod.

Page 2

Page 3

Here is the link if you can't read this.

http://www.google.com/patents?...#v=onepage&q&f=false

Thanks, Tom.

Elegant idea, I am glad that Breguet came through with his "trick" bends for the Hairspering control instead. This was very informative. Thanks guys.