Hello fellow IHC members-

I have an old cuckoo in my shop that I do not have much info on. The customer would like to date it and get some idea of current worth. I hope I have attached a few pictures of the clock and movement. It is not clear to me how this is done.


The only identification is a "G.K." on the movement. It is a quarter sounding quail (count wheel - does not repeat) and hour cuckoo. A large clock, it is about 12" wide by 18" tall. Even though it has heavy weights, it is only 30 hours of running time.

Anyone have an idea about age and value?

Thanx,

Bruce Weeks

Hi Bruce,
Only thing I can add is that it is probably from the very early 1900s. The Lyre shape on the movement is pretty old. Also that type of pendulum is very old. I'll look at my books when I get home to see if they show anything similar, but unfortunately there isn't a lot I've found on cuckoo clocks. There are two books that I have on Black Forest clocks, and they tend to deal in the really early ones.


Andy

Bruce,
I have looked in Kochmann's book. To determine the age many details are needed.

The structure and design of the wheels and arbors, case construction, types of wood used, type and materials used for dial and numbers.

I could not find the plate design in the book. They lyre design was used in many movements, although most of them were more square shaped and not the longer rectangles.

There is a case pictured that is quite similar to yours, but it states that is came with a wooden movement. The date given to that case is "19th century.


More detailed pictures of the construction of the wheels and arbors might be needed to get a closer date. Either that or someone that knows!!

Thanks Tom & Andy,

I took it down this weekend to clean and have a few more details. The inside bottom of each plate is stamped "14", I presume to keep them paired during build. The cuckoo pin wheel is also stamped "G.SCH.W.", presumably the maker. Plates are cast and lathe turned to flatten, wheels are apparently cast too with crossings already cast in mounted on collets. Pinions are lantern style with turned ends. Latching levers are cast as well. Motion work is driven directly by extension of the great wheel arbor which drives the leaf spring for the hand clutch, thus driving both minute and hours hands with this wheel. Minute and hour cannons pivot on a fixed shaft with double nutted minute hand (one to hold it to the minute cannon and another to hold the whole assembly on). The rectangular plate shape allows all three trains to be nearly in vertical alignment.

The box is pine with walnut veneer on the outside. Can't tell what wood the carvings are mode from, but it is a hardwood. Pediment is retained by typical hokk-and-eye arangement. The birds are painted softwood with actuated wings and metal "nibs".

Bellows are modern replacements, so no clues there. Hands appear to be sawed bone, not celluloid. The numerals appear to be celluloid though. Chain hooks are formed from wire as opposed to modern stampings. Chains are hard brass.

Any more information is appreciated!

The customer is excited to hear that I have some data on the origin of his clock. Does anyone know where and when Gebruder Kuner made clocks? And any idea of the value?

I know if you tried to buy one of this style, size and complexity from say, Herbert Herr, it would costs upwards of $800-1200!

I appreciate all your help.

Oh, yes. I forgot to mention that there is also stamped on the cuckoo great wheel, "G. SCH. W.". If that helps.

Bruce,
I could not find any history on your maker. I did find that clocks are still being made under that name. The following two links may be interesting.

http://www.allabouttime.net/cgi-bin/miva?Merchant2/merchant.mv+Product_Code=N8236&Screen=PROD&Store_Code=AAT

http://www.commercemarketplace.com/shops/allabouttime/page2.html

Thanks Tom,

I especially like the HH shelf version. We have a cat that absolutely NOT leave the weights and chains alone!

Bruce,

You won't like the HH shelf model. I bought one a few years ago, and it only runs for about 5 days! It needs stronger springs. Here is a link to a new quail cuckoo clock I got a few years ago (Hubert Herr mvt).

New Quail Cuckoo clock.

Andy

Interesting. My wife would really like a shelf version though. We saw quite a few at Karl Barathy's auction last year but didn't have the cash at that time (unemployed, but thankfully now gainfully employed). Maybe I could build one from Cuckoo parts and a bim-bam movement? I kinda liked the ones with inlay strips. Might be a good excersize of my woodworking skills. The inlay strips can be bought if I did not want to take the time to make them. Conversely I have a Dremel 4" table saw for that fine work.

Oh well, I still need to drywall the inside of the clock shop yet, and trim and paint, slatwall would sure be nice . . .

Might be a little late jumping in on this but...

I have a Gebruder Kuner Catalog that is dated 1904.

Your clock is very simular to the model #561 (pictured in the catalog)

The only difference is yours is cuckoo and quail.

The clock was listed at $9.00 (retail) in 1904.

After looking at your pictures, I would put your clock to the late 1890's to the early 1900's say 1890 to 1910

Your movement is cast, but the plates are held together with nuts (instead of the earlier pins)

Hands are bone, but of the later style.

If your cuckoo was around 1890 to 1910 the birds should be wood, and slim. It would also rest on a perch of wood...

After about 1910 the perch were cast out of brass...

A cuckoo quail of that size and age and quality of carvin would sell for about $400 to $500 at a mart... maybe a little more on ebay.. in a retail shop I have seen them ask $1000

Hope this helps

Justin J. Miller

The "SCH." stamped is short for Schwarzwald

GREAT! Thanks for everyones' help. I take this one ack to the cusomer sometime this week. I'm sure he'll be quite pleased to hear all we were able to collectively find out.